You’re F#¢%ing Up LinkedIn || How To Do LinkedIn Right

Episode Notes

Transcript

Gyi Tsakalakis: Before we get started, we want to thank our sponsors Clio, Lawyaw, Posh Virtual Receptionist and Nota.  The official end of summer.  The school bell is ringing and parents everywhere celebrate.  Conrad, when your kids go back to school?

Conrad Saam: Well, out in Pacific Northwest, we wait until September.  So, while I’m seeing all these beautiful pictures of all these perfectly dressed and well-coiffed kids going off to their first day of school, my kids are still running around out in the backyard with their shoes off.  So, we’ve got a little way to go.  But I was thinking about the back-to-school season and there’s a great opportunity right now.  Like we’re always looking for ways for lawyers to do well in the community and be recognized for that.  There are teachers right now in low-income school district who are funding your kids or their student’s classroom supplies and that is a travesty.  And this is a really easy way for lawyers to walk in, sponsor a grade, sponsor baseball team, sponsor an individual teacher, because you’ve got to love teachers, right?  And this is a great way to just get into the community, be recognized, do some good work and make a real difference and it’s easy.

Gyi Tsakalakis: So many communities, like a school is a central meeting place.  It’s key to local communities in so many communities.  And so, right now the energy is up, right?  The kids are all frustrated because summer is over but parents and teachers and community folks coming together in the school, I think it’s a natural place for relationship building in local community.  So, great tips there Conrad, what else we talked about today?

Conrad Saam: We, as usual, Legal Marketing News for the week, that’s some cool stuff.  We’ve got a little bit of an inside track on one of those pieces.  This is going to be episode about LinkedIn.  We have not talked much about LinkedIn to our detriment, but we’re going to get deep on LinkedIn.  We are going to talk about kind of the dirty ugly underbelly of LinkedIn as well as how to do LinkedIn right and some tactical tips on how to make that work for you.  Before we get there, we’re going to listen to some tunes.

[Music]

Male: Welcome to Lunch Hour Legal Marketing, teaching you how to promote, market and make fat stacks for your legal practice here on Legal Talk Network.

[Music]

Conrad Saam: Welcome everyone to Lunch Hour Legal Marketing.  We’ve got a great episode for you today.  But first, let’s do some news.

[Music]

Conrad Saam: All right, let me scare the pants off of everyone right now.  Amazon announced that it will be offering mental health support through a partnership.  But Amazon now providing mental health support services, right?  This is moving very, very close into the professional services world.  I’m very lucky that there’s a couple fortuitous parts to this.  Number one, is I moved to the Seattle area which is the headquarters of the big A.  And number two, I did that right out of business school in 2000 when a bunch of my friends started at Amazon.  Many of whom spend more than 20 years there and we’re going to, at some point, try and get content and an episode from them to talk about what would happen if Jeff Bezos ran a law firm.

Okay.  So, that was my insider track.  The real insider track that we have is from your inside source at the American Bar Association, ABA sides against opening law firms up to new competition.  Gyi, what’s going on here?  Talk to me about the ABA and their thoughts on protectionism.  Oh, wait, did I say that out loud?

Gyi Tsakalakis: Well, Protectionism, but I don’t speak for the ABA.  I just happen to have the great privilege of serving — currently serving as a chair of the tech show.  And so, there’ve been a lot of conversations.  Even before this year, I mean, this is obviously an ongoing thing.  But the point that you’re making the news item here is that the ABA has sided against the opening up law firms to new competition by reaffirming their very long-held position that non-lawyer ownership of law firms is inconsistent with the core values of the legal profession.  Despite the ABA’s position on this, we know states are already — some states already moving forward with whether it’s removing Rule 5.4, updating some of their regulatory sandbox schemes.

(00:05:00)

And you know, look, again, I don’t speak for the ABA, but I will say that there are a lot of different voices at the ABA on this.  And so, I think it’s important for people to remember that even though the ABA — they vote on these things and it comes out with this position.  Kind of twofold.  One is, is that in my view of it, my perspective, there are more voices in the, “hey, maybe we should reconsider this camp,” then there had been in a while.  And two, the market is moving forward with or without the ABA, right?  The consumers are looking for the end arounds and there are lawyers who are innovating around this.  And so, this is going to continue to be a big issue.  My take is that if you’re in this like, oh no lawyers are bust, you’re going to be in trouble over the next 5 to 10 years.  It parallels with your original news.  I know about basis coming into law as well.  Big four getting into law, I mean, to me, the ship’s kind of sailed but it is what it is.

Conrad Saam: And finally, last news item, our good friends over at Lead Docket released some awesome new automation, right?  Lead Docket has been – I would say it was one of their earliest sophisticated intake management software and it’s great to see them continuing to innovate and bring more features to their clients, but the focus on automation is not a surprise for me.  If you are a Lead Docket client, you’re probably been hit up already to view the demo.  I got a sneak peek on that it is really slick.  So, check out the automation coming out of Lead Docket.  For now, we’re going to throw to break.  We’re going to talk about people that are not namely Docket but do service the Legal Marketing Industry.

[Music]

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[Music]

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[Music]

Gyi Tsakalakis: And once again, it is time for one of our favorite segments, The Legal Trends Report Minute, brought to you by Clio.

[Music]

Gyi Tsakalakis: So, here’s an interesting thing.  Legal Trends Report says that growing law firms are twice as likely to use firm reporting tools.  One of the biggest differences in technology adoption among growing firms from the study is their use of firm reporting tools, reporting tools analyze for this report offer insights into key business metrics such as revenue generation, bill collection and productivity.  The takeaway from this data is that growing firms are more likely to increase their revenues because they have access to information insights that help them assess how their business is performing, which also allows them to focus more attention on planning for additional ongoing growth over the long term.  You know, it made me think about conversations we have lawyers all the time, like Conrad?  Like what are you measuring, how are you benchmarking against other firms, like the only way to do that is to have the tools and place to actually report on that information, right?

Conrad Saam: Well, I look at it this way, I’ve been thinking about this a lot.  The growing law firms have typically a person who is becoming less of a lawyer and more of a CEO and this is exactly what you’re seeing here.  And I don’t want to say that that’s the way it should be for.  In fact, that’s not the way it should be for all law firms.  Having said that, the aggressively growing law firms have people who are adopting the CEO mindset and that requires — I mean, this is just basic fundamental business metric.  It’s an understanding of productivity, right?  That they talk about.  It’s an understanding of fundamentals of accounting.  It’s an understanding of how we’re doing on recruiting.  It’s an understanding of what our cash flow looks like, right?  So, all of these things become really, really — it’s obvious that the growing firms are operating more like a business.  Check, check.  Right back to our conversation about what if Jeff Bezos run a law firm, right?  Like none of this is a surprise, but the growing literacy among the leaders of growing law firms in terms of their business, understanding, and acumen, and ability to manage a firm as if they were a business leader as opposed to a lawyer who happened to be at the head of the pyramid.

(00:10:09)

Gyi Tsakalakis: Yeah.  And if you want to get in on the benchmarking study that Conrad is putting together, hit them up, because we’d love to include you in that data as well.  To learn more about these opportunities and much more for free, download Clio’s Legal Trends Report at clio.com/trends.  That’s Clio spelled C-L-I-O.

Conrad Saam: All right, moving on.  We’re going to our LinkedIn session and we’re going to be talking all about LinkedIn, we’re going to start with my favorite type of topic, how to do LinkedIn really, really poorly.  And then we’re going to move into the positive.  So, we’re going to talk about — I have to read it from the show notes.  I can’t come up with a better title, guys this is called LinkedIn fck Ups.

Gyi Tsakalakis: Get the explicit tag out.

Conrad Saam: Get the explicit –

Gyi Tsakalakis: Not safe for children.

Conrad Saam: NC17 LinkedIn Fck Ups followed by LinkedIn awesomeness.  I’ve been looking at this title, trying to come up with a better way to say this, but we’re going to talk about this.  The first thing Gyi that I see people do poorly with LinkedIn, and this is really obvious to SEOs, but most lawyers are missing the boat on this is the profile that they’ve so carefully curated and written and spent time hemming and hawing over the right words they put on their website.  They just cut and paste it onto their LinkedIn profile.

Gyi Tsakalakis: Gross.

Conrad Saam: What’s the SEO problem with this?

Gyi Tsakalakis: Copy and pasting your well-crafted, bio?

Conrad Saam: Yeah.

Gyi Tsakalakis: I mean, you’re competing with your own site, creating a duplicate page.

Conrad Saam: Yeah, duplicate content, right?  And LinkedIn does an amazingly good job at ranking for name search.  But as soon as you copy and paste yourself into your own LinkedIn profile, you’re not competing with yourself.  And one of those sites is not going to show for your name search huge, huge problem, because you control what’s in LinkedIn and that’s a great opportunity to actually really shine when people are doing that kind of online vetting process for that offline referral.  LinkedIn is better at name search than anything.  It would be my take, right Gyi, you disagree?

Gyi Tsakalakis: Well, Google business profiles are pretty good, too, but if you’re counting that I don’t know if you count that one and then exact match on your domain of your own domain is a good one.  But yes, LinkedIn otherwise the social platform.  For sure LinkedIn is coming up for name search.  I think, under this whole segment, and maybe not so much on the profile stuff, but to me, some of the biggest mistakes that lawyers are making on LinkedIn is focusing on gaming the platform versus actually trying to connect with people, share information and it takes us to this idea of engagement pods, which we’ll put a LinkedIn to walk you through it.  But short version is, I agree to post on your stuff, you agree to post on mine or comment on mine, and we’ll try to increase each other’s engagement.  You get enough people doing this.

LinkedIn wants to surface posts that have the most engagement.  Of course, the problem is that these pod, these engagement groups, one, they’re like quid pro quo posting and commenting and engagement, like, they’re not really there to actually engage in.  So, it comes out in the comments, so we had this conversation, Conrad, myself, and a couple of other folks on LinkedIn, where you see a post that’s something like, productivity is so important to me, and then the comments are like, inspirational, or like 20 great posts, like literally the same thing over and over.  And when you see the same people getting this kind of engagement over and over again, it becomes so obvious that it’s just manufactured and it just immediately loses authenticity.  So, it can be done more seamlessly?  Maybe.  But again, just overall, once I see that the damage is done, it just seems so fake.  It’s like back to blog post commenting or something.

Conrad Saam: But, I mean, the issue here Gyi is, it’s so obviously fake to you and I, right?  And I think these engagement pods go even worse.  I think that there is and I’ve seen this where it is just a circle of people, right?  A pot of people.  Someone else is logging into each of those accounts, and then they’re just copying and pasting the same exact comments.  And it just rotates.  The same comments showing up on different people’s comments within that over and over again.  It’s so awful.

Gyi Tsakalakis: Depending on what’s the substance of the post and the comments are, it’s arguable that you’re in the misleading communications about a lawyer service, misleading violation of rule 7.1, right?  Because you’re, like, paying — a lot of these are paid, right?

(00:15:02)

So, you’re paying these people to be in this thing and you’re trying to make it look like it’s just this authentic commenting, maybe a little bit of stretcher, but if you post something like, just, got another great result for a client and then a bunch of people you paid to say, nice job and congratulations, it’s like, well, those aren’t really real, right?  They’re people you paid to write that stuff, so I don’t know.

Conrad Saam: Paid reviews, paid comments.  Boy, we wallow in the mud Gyi.  Needs to take a hot shower.

Gyi Tsakalakis: Tell us about beautiful headshots, Conrad.

Conrad Saam: This is a great Wall Street Journal article that came out, and I was kind of surprised by the commentary that came back on.  The article on the Wall Street Journal was the perfect LinkedIn profile headshot and photographers charging $1,000 or more.  Many of the photographers cited were well over $1,000 for that perfect LinkedIn profile headshot.  And I read this at the same time that I ran into two instances of law firm websites where literally the head, they were decapitated photos, and the reason they were decapitated photos was because they were stock photos that clearly weren’t the attorney.  And so, you had to cut the attorney’s head off, not just misleading, it was so bad, but the better alternative was to have literally decapitated attorneys.  They were all good-looking people in suits, but, without a head.

And so, I was starting to think about how much would you pay for that headshot?  And as we talk about positioning and differentiation and why you’re special, I think if you can grab an image that does an amazing job of capturing who you are, not the fact that you’re a lawyer, you’re not holding a freaking gavel, you’re not on the courtroom steps with the Brooks Brothers suit and a superman cape on behind you.  But like, capturing the who of who you are and being able to communicate your positioning in as Malcolm Gladwell will call it, a blink of an eye.  That is amazingly powerful.  And to me, a $1,000 is a low cost that I would pay for that.  I don’t know what you think, it sounds like we’re throwing money around here at photographers, but that is so powerful.

Gyi Tsakalakis: Yes.  And one of the first things that everybody will tell you to do and put some kind of photo up there.  Because the worst thing you can possibly have is just like the generic, it just shows that you’re not even on LinkedIn.  It’s weird because I’ll see people that are actually posting on LinkedIn with just the LinkedIn avatar thing, like the empty profile thing.  To this conversation I thought it was the worst thing you could do, but probably worse to have a crop stock photo of somebody else has your profile.  So, it’s probably better to do nothing if you’re going to do stock photos or gavels or poorly cropped images.  But yeah, this forms an impression in people’s minds about you, whether you like it or not.  Like, people go look you up there.  It comes up for name search.  We’ve seen the horror stories with images, but it seems like a good investment.  I mean, it’s no different than investing in anything else you’re doing to make a presentation to a client or potential clients, for lack of repeating myself in a better word, it’s your avatar out there, so definitely worth investing in.

Conrad Saam: I would say at the very least, go hire a starving wedding photographer to come in mid-week and shoot the firm, right?  It’s so worth it, the imagery is just absolutely worth it.

Gyi Tsakalakis: Same with the cover imagery as well.  Some of the cover imagery is just like people try to put their logos in there and they’re just not formatted right and it’s not –

Conrad Saam: When you say cover imagery, what do you mean?

Gyi Tsakalakis: So, behind it if you’re looking at a profile, there’s a place to add an image.

Conrad Saam: Oh, yeah, sorry.  Yes, we we’re still on the LinkedIn side of things.  Yeah, but think about, like — I thought you were referring to a hero image on the site.  But think about that background that you can put up on LinkedIn.  There’s so much you can communicate with that.  I have a logo of mockingbird, right?  I could probably do a lot more to talk about the positioning mockingbird with that cover imagery, right?

Gyi Tsakalakis: Yeah.  And check it out on both your mobile device is really important because, again a lot of people are accessing LinkedIn on an app.  Even if it looks right in your browser on your desktop, make sure you check in on mobile because it doesn’t always crop right.  And so, spend some time on that, because all of your awesome positioning might get lost if it gets formatted improperly on mobile.

Conrad Saam: All right, now that we’ve crapped on LinkedIn, let’s take a break.  But when we return, do these things do crush it?

[Music]

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(00:20:01)

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[Music]

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Gyi Tsakalakis: On LinkedIn.  And just a reminder, if you’re interested in that benchmarking report, benchmarking your firm against hundreds of other law firms by practice area, check out mockingbirdmarketing.com/benchmark, you can sign up right there.

All right, now let’s talk crushing LinkedIn.  We’ll drop a couple profiles probably in the show, notes of folks we think are doing well.  But one person that comes to mind right away, and I know you’re a big fan of hers as well is Rookie to Johnny.  I mean she does such amazing — like just go look at how her profile and her post and I think a lot of the stuff that were going to talk about will start resonating but let’s talk.  Conrad, what things do you see lawyers doing really well on LinkedIn?

Conrad Saam: Well, I think I’m going to start with this very simple thing, and Rookie is a great example of this.  She lets the who she is come out so beautifully and so genuinely, and frankly, she is one of the more positive people I’ve ever met in my life, and that just — like, it just comes out of her LinkedIn profile, and I’m not hiring a lawyer anymore, I’m building a relationship with someone who like, I want to be around.  And I think she does a really good job on that.  The counterpoint on that is like no one reads your resume, even those recruiters don’t read the full resume, and the job of LinkedIn is not to be that full resume repository.  It’s to let who you are come out.  You can do that if you think a little bit outside of the box.  So, I would really kind of lean into letting who you are; why you went to law school?  Like all of those things come out in her profile, and it’s just inspirational.  It’s not that hard, because most of you have a good story behind there, right?  Most of you do.

Gyi Tsakalakis: Yeah.  The first thing that I usually think about beyond just like the profile basics is the headline, because to your point about — it’s a blank.  You don’t have much time.  You’re not going to read the whole resume, but literally — if you’re listening to this and you got your phone, you got LinkedIn on your phone, just go in into LinkedIn and go look at her profile and see the limited real estate you’ve got, but the headline is, the thing, right?  Are you telling your audience or your connections, who you help, how you help them, why you’re uniquely qualified to help?  If those three things don’t jump out in that headline, that’s the first place that I would start in terms of optimizing your profile.

Conrad Saam: All right, I’m going to go back to what you and I grew up on professionally.  LinkedIn is an algorithm.  In the same way that — and this happens on most of the social networks as well, but like you need to understand that you are playing with and dealing with an algorithm.  That means that you need to monitor, how things are performing test, how things were performing, trying to understand how the algorithm works, approach this from — In fact, speaking — this is funny, it all comes together, AVA Texture, Rookie to Johnny, Conrad Saam and Gyi all on the same topic.  We did, actually Rookie and I put together proposal to talk about using data to make decisions on how you are using your social media and what you’re tactically doing with social media.

So, that’s what I’m talking about here.  These algorithms change over time and you need to look at your success and data to support your success, or failures with what you’re doing to evaluate how you’re doing with LinkedIn.  I will tell you this, I am fairly certain about 10 days to two weeks ago

(00:25:00)

There was a fundamental shift in the LinkedIn algorithm that has really changed the reach, the way your reach actually evolves on LinkedIn.  That happened within the last two weeks.  No one’s talking about this stuff, right?  No one is saying about this, but I’m seeing it in the numbers that we’ve been looking at, because we look at the numbers and if you don’t look at the numbers and you just throwing stuff up there, you won’t learn the algo, so think about learning this as an algo just like we talked about the search algos.

Gyi Tsakalakis: And speaking of measuring, there’s a tool called Shield App.  I think it’s shieldask.ai that has much more robust reporting on things like engagement and reach and all this kind of stuff.  But you can get out of LinkedIn but it just makes a lot easier —

Conrad Saam: It’s brutal.

Gyi Tsakalakis: It is brutal.

Conrad Saam: And I think it’s like $39 a year or something like that.  Shield App is, if you’re spending a lot of time on LinkedIn — we’ll put in the show notes, but it’s a really good resource.

Gyi Tsakalakis: Now, this is a subject for another day, but Microsoft bought this thing and it just see — I thought this would be like an instant rebuild and it’s just the underlying technology just seems so problematic.  But anyway, the next big thing, there’s kind of like two — it’s twofold for me, is the featured content area, and using featured content to highlight video of you, again talking about why you practice, who you helped, why you’re uniquely qualified, like this is your opportunity to do your intro.  You can do it also as a profile video.  So, if someone clicks on your profile photo, you can create a little video.  I think that’s effective too, but the truth is that a lot of people don’t click on those but the featured section commands a lot of real estate on your profile.  And so, pinning stuff to whether it’s — it can be anything from client testimonials if those are permissible in your state, it can be video of you talking about what you do, why you do it.  It can be post, you can highlight post that you’ve just text post, might be awards that you’ve won.  But you know, the same things you talk about in terms of credentialing and validating your expertise on your website.  That’s the place to do it on LinkedIn.

Conrad Saam: All right.  Next tip for me is do a 4:1 ratio on outreach first posting.  By the way, I, guilty of this, but spend a lot more time talking to other people, commenting other people, identifying other people, connecting with other people, debating with other people.  I had a great argument this morning on LinkedIn with a really good friend, and he’s wrong.  But that’s where the relationships happen, right?  And so, if you are just posting regularly, your over-investing in the content creation.  We talk about this all the time.  We have this blogging too, like it’s not content marketing, its marketing content.  And so, I have a strong belief that you should be spending, basically a 4:1 ratio on connecting with people and commenting.  By connecting, I do not mean blowing out every LinkedIn recommends you might know this person, right?  That’s not what I’m talking about.  I’m talking about the kind of deeper relationships, targeted relationships, relationship to input time developing as opposed to increasing your follower account or increasing those fake comment accounts, right?

Gyi Tsakalakis: And so, Conrad you mentioned something there that I think a lot of folks don’t even realize the distinction between which are connections and following.  Instead of going out and just mass connecting and making connection requests to people you don’t know, if you get somebody’s name, you meet somebody but you’re not really — you’re just at the beginning of starting that relationship.  You may follow them first and then that will — when you start following them, their content will show up in your feed, and then maybe you start engaging with some of their post, right?  So, you like stuff that they are writing or maybe you have something a comment to leave.

We see this happen all the time where the connection goes from a follow to connect and so many times for me, I’ll start with the follow and engage with their posts without even requesting connection, and then they’ll request the connection for me because they’re like, “Oh I see, that you’re actually engage.”  So, it’s a much more natural authentic way to connect.  So, check out the following and again the same thing we’ve talked about in any other context, like look for the folks who are good referral sources, look for people you know in your local community.  Those are the people that I think that you really just make, it depends on your practice.  But if you’re a local lawyer serving a local community, find those people, those community —

Conrad Saam: Most of you are.

Gyi Tsakalakis: Yeah, finding those community, influencers, for lack of a better word, community leaders on LinkedIn and engaging with them.  It’s a great way to stay top of mind over longer period of time without — you know, and this just feels totally natural.

Conrad Saam: Here’s the next one for me.  You need to realize that LinkedIn wants you to stay on LinkedIn.

Gyi Tsakalakis: Right.

(00:30:00)

Conrad Saam: And play their game.  Don’t hate the player, hate the game.  Play their game.  So, for example, if you link out to a YouTube video, it’s going to take someone away from LinkedIn.  LinkedIn probably doesn’t like that.  Having said that, the right way to do that is to have video live on LinkedIn.  I do this almost every morning now.  LinkedIn, Facebook, run that live, right?  And so, they’re much more happy to have people sitting there watching Conrad talk or whomever talk on the LinkedIn platform than over YouTube, right?  And so, that’s a great way to play the algorithm and play nice with your host LinkedIn.

Gyi Tsakalakis: Right.  And then, another dovetail on that one is not just the links to videos, not just YouTube, but really links in post as well.  So if you just share a link in a post, there’s been a bunch of studies around this and I think as you mentioned Conrad I think they’re trying to fix this a little bit because people are trying to take so much advantage of it but for now the understanding and a lot of the research has been done, if you have a post that you want to write about something or use an image and you don’t include the link, you add the link as a comment on the post, you get more reach.  Now, again, this is kind of one where it’s like, I could go either way on it.  I mean I get the idea of reach, but from a user experience, it’s very frustrating to–

Conrad Saam: Terrible.

Gyi Tsakalakis: –just see the image, right?  And then have to go find the link in the comments, right?

Conrad Saam: Right.

Gyi Tsakalakis: Especially if it’s a thread that has a lot of comments and the kind of with the link gets pushed down, but balancing, gaming out of those and providing a better experience for the people you engage with.  You have to kind of find a balance there I suppose, and I’ve done it both ways.

Conrad Saam: I would say, we are religiously, put the link in the comments.

Gyi Tsakalakis: Yeah.  I mean –You want that—can I get that reach.

Conrad Saam: Got to get to reach, play the game, right?  Because it works.

Gyi Tsakalakis: We’ll see.  Yeah

Conrad Saam: I got nothing.

Gyi Tsakalakis: I got one more.

Conrad Saam: Go.

Gyi Tsakalakis: This is kind of like the more, I don’t know, it’s not really philosophical, but I guess it’s more like concept or tactical.  But you know, you’ll see this all the time, the LinkedIn police like don’t post your personal stuff on LinkedIn.

Conrad Saam: Oh my God.

Gyi Tsakalakis: And I’m like so that’s just all wrong.  First of all, post whatever you want.  But I do think that part of the authenticity and part of the getting to know people is letting who you are shine through.  And so, whether you want to celebrate a family member or something you’ve had gone in your personal life or you want to share something beyond just like your work stuff.  I think that’s — and guess what, you see that stuff tends to get the most engagement.  Now, sometimes–

Conrad Saam: Get for puppies.

Gyi Tsakalakis: Yeah, puppy is number one.  But sometimes you get the LinkedIn, place that come by and again, if you feel that way that LinkedIn is not Facebook and should be only work stuff, we’d love to hear from you.  You can go comment on my post on LinkedIn and tell me how I’m wrong.  But you know again, if you really think about the value of the tool, the value of the tool is a connecting tool and I can’t tell you how many times where like I’ll post something.  You know, I try to loosely like tie it back to work stuff, right?  Like I’ll have my toddler on my lap and I’m at work, so it’s like, okay.  But the point is, is that — guess what happens?  People send me messages, send me emails “Hey, congratulations on your whatever trip that you went on with your family, it looks like it’s a really good time.”  But people are watching that stuff and it’s sticking with them better than just if you’re just like productivity hack number 755, right?  Anyway, there’s a note kind of final tip there.  Be yourself, let your– 

Conrad Saam: Be yourself.

Gyi Tsakalakis: Just like you would in other marketing materials.  Let your authentic self-come through.

Conrad Saam: And if you disagree with us, you’re welcome to join LHLM where Gyi and Conrad were like sorry for your misguided thoughts.

Gyi Tsakalakis: Yes.  And we’ll send you a stock image of a gavel that you can use on your head shot because–

Conrad Saam: No, but the point here is like–

Gyi Tsakalakis: Obviously, they are expert.

Conrad Saam: We started this talking about rookie and for me the fact that she’s a trademark lawyer, like that’s such a small part of who she is to me and I don’t know her that well, but like I’ve gotten to know her because she loves her personality shine through.  She’d memorable person, right?  And if all I knew about her was her freaking resume from her carefully crafted LinkedIn profile and a corporate shot that gave out no personality.  Like, we would not be talking about her right now, right?  And it’s not that we’re talking about her that’s important.  It’s the fact that she’s memorable for a great reason that makes her awesome.  So, if you get the LinkedIn police telling you not to –you know what, I’ve heard this like we can take this further.  Don’t talk politics, don’t do this, don’t do that.  Like, you know what?  I’ll use this as an example.  I’ll go the other side of this like I am adamantly not religious, right?  And the people who are and share that faith like it works for the right person, right?  And it’s not, it works for the right person.  Otherwise, you’re just a lawyer without a personality.

(00:35:01)

Gyi Tsakalakis: Be real.

Conrad Saam: Be real.  Don’t let your LinkedIn be beige.

Gyi Tsakalakis: Awesome.  Well, that’s all the time we have for today.  Thank you, dear listeners, for dropping in for another episode of Lunch Hour Legal Marketing.  If you just landed here, because someone randomly said check this podcast out because it’s terrible, please do subscribe on your favorite podcasting subscription service.  We are on Spotify, we’re on Apple and as always, we’d love to hear from you.  So, whether you find our emails or send us messages, my DMs are open on Twitter, so you can hit them hard.  We want to hear what you would like to hear if you’ve got ideas for topics and if you have feedback, please do remember to leave reviews because it warms our little Lunch Hour Legal Marketing hearts.  Until next time, Gyi and Conrad, Lunch Hour Legal Marketing, Farewell.

[Music]

Male: Thank you for listening to Lunch Hour Legal Marketing.  If you would like more information about what you heard today, please visit legaltalknetwork.com.  Subscribe via Apple podcasts and RSS.  Follow Legal Talk Network on Twitter, Facebook, LinkedIn and Instagram.

[Music]

Conrad Saam: That’s the wrong one.

Gyi Tsakalakis: No, that’s perfect.  You can’t do tasks and back to school.  That’s exactly what you’re channeling my children.  We might need to keep this in.  So, for the dear listener, we had planned on doing a back-to-school intro.  Adam unintentionally added taps, which my daughter who does play the trumpet is probably, if she were to thematically add music to her feeling about going back to school, that is exactly what would happen.

Conrad Saam: All right.  There’s our easter egg, one more time here.

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