New Cohost Tony Sipp Helps Kick Off A Year Of Big Upcoming Events

Episode Notes

Transcript

[Music]

Jill Francisco: Welcome back to another episode of The Paralegal Voice on the Legal Talk Network.  I’m Jill Francisco, your host and I’m the immediate past president of NALA and I’m super excited to be joining you guys today for another fun episode of The Paralegal Voice, and we have a super exciting like really exciting.  I feel like we need like a drumroll or something, but guess who’s back.  If you guys have been listening to my shows here recently, you’ve heard we’ve had a couple recently and then I had one about a year ago with a wonderful friend and colleague of mine, Tony Sipp.  And we’re going to make a great announcement today that Tony, if you wonder why he keeps coming back, he is going to be our new co-host.  Woohoo, Tony.  Do we have the clapping applause on the background?  But yeah, Tony I’m super excited.  I kept wanting to know when we could announce this and like I said, for our listeners that’s been tuning in here recently, Tony is a paralegal manager but also doing paralegal work, has done paralegal work so he’s very in tune with paralegals at Manning Kass and where he manages the paralegals at this time and they have seven nationwide offices.  So I’m going to let Tony kind of touch on his background a little bit but I just want to say I’m super excited.  I’ve known Tony for a lot of years actually probably when we first met at past NALA conferences and it’s like we’re friends but we’re not like every day talking friends.  So I think it’s super cool that we can come together and we both still have our independent thoughts and contributions that hopefully will just come together and measure well to get the most benefit from our listeners.  So Tony, welcome.

Tony Sipp: Hi.  Thank you.  Thank you, Jill.  I appreciate it.  Yeah, I’m very excited to be a part of this now and co-hosting with you.  Little bit about myself as Jill mentioned, I am the paralegal manager for Manning & Kass.  We have seven nationwide offices.  I really enjoy what I do and I enjoy working with our paralegals and other paralegals outside of the firm.  I’m the past president of LAPA, Los Angeles Paralegal Association for 2020.  I was elected twice for the Greater Valley Glen Neighborhood Council and I was the chair of the government relations as well as a treasurer on the committee for safety.  To say I was busy, I was very busy.  So I stepped down from that elected position and now I’m focusing on my paralegal work and I’m just helping other paralegals get better and thrive.

Jill Francisco: Well, and you know it’s funny you say that because I think that’s a characteristic.  You just proved if no one believed you’re a paralegal or we’re in tune with paralegals, they do now because you were too busy and you had to step down or something because I think that’s a number one characteristic of paralegals.  We try to — we do it all, we want to do it all, we are excited to do it all and sometimes though we have to take a step back in, whether it’s through prioritize or the way things come up in life, you have to sometimes let something go because I know that you probably agree with this.  I’ve tried to tried to teach myself, I tried to make my husband tell me and remind me, but it’s better to do lesser things really well than do a ton of things kind of okay.

Tony Sipp: Yeah.  I highly agree.  My plan was take my legal experience, bring it to the government and apply my political skills as well as my legal skills.  And I did that, I did that, but as you say, just you want to do one thing really, really well instead of doing a lot of things poorly.

Jill Francisco: I was looking you know, and obviously I’ve looked at your bio a couple times, but I saw that you went to a school in New York.  I didn’t know that, your education.

Tony Sipp: I did.  I went to Fordham University Jesuit School.  It was a great school that tried to make you well-rounded.  And so from New York I moved out here.

Jill Francisco: Cross country.

Tony Sipp: In California.  Yes.  Met my wife and here I am.

Jill Francisco: And so were you originally from the east?

Tony Sipp: Yes.

Jill Francisco: Okay.  All right. Well, maybe that’s —

Tony Sipp: Yeah, I’m a New Yorker.

Jill Francisco: I see you made another — like I’m from Pennsylvania originally.

Tony Sipp: Oh.

Jill Francisco: See?  There’s something you don’t know that.

Tony Sipp: I didn’t know that.

Jill Francisco: And so now, maybe secretly it’s the northern and us.

Tony Sipp: It might be.

Jill Francisco: There is something about you know, I don’t know, calling us Yankees or something you know that sometimes get turn around.  But anyway, I know, when I saw that I was like, hey, I didn’t know Tony was here.  I thought you’re always West Coast living out there.

(00:05:05)

Tony Sipp: Cali.  No.  No, I adapt it but I’m still in New York.

Jill Francisco: Well, that’s kind of me.  I mean, I went — I’m telling my age of course but you know, I was up in Pennsylvania until ‘90 and left to come to Marshall University which of course is in Huntington, West Virginia and never left.  So I think I went home maybe my first year.  You know, you’re still kind of like going home then I never left.  Met my husband here and you know, here we go.  You know how it is but–

Tony Sipp: I left just after 9/11 and that’s it.  I had been back but I haven’t been back recently.  All of my family left there too so it’s different.

Jill Francisco: So it’s okay.  It’s different, it’s different.

Tony Sipp: Yeah.

Jill Francisco: But anyway, I’m so excited to have Tony here and like I said, I think our listeners are going to hopefully really enjoy the different things, the new things and like I said, Tony and I are basically on opposite sides of the country so we got it covered hopefully if stuffs happening locally and also nationally.  We both are — Tony mentioned that you were past president of LAPA that’s of course a NALA affiliate where I was past president, charter president actually years and years ago of our NALA affiliate here in West Virginia.  And so Tony and I are kind of in tune still with local and then of course you know, doing some stuff in the community.  It’s funny I didn’t do anything as formal as you with the community but elected office but here recently at our firm, we’ve tried to really be more intentional on community service and a friend of I, you can imagine another paralegal and I, we’ve deemed our self the event staff which is —

Tony Sipp: Shocking.

Jill Francisco: Which is a disaster to itself but it’s been really cool because we’ve really tried to pull legal because as you know, attorneys and where all they’re supposed to do their pro bono work and things like that and I think it’s cool that the paralegals have really kind of stepped up and got involved in this and we’ve tried to every month to have kind of a little theme based upon what’s going on that month maybe nationally there’s something you know, like with the Heart Association I think was this month and coat drives at that time of the year and it’s really neat because paralegals I think like I said, attorneys want to give, other staff in the office want to give but sometimes the organization and the time to devote is not there and so we’ve really tried to do that and I’m sure Dinsmore is a big thing of community and community service.  I’m sure your firm is too and we’ve kind of stepped up to do that.  So it’s been kind of a thing that, it’s rewarding.  So I know why you do those kind of community things.  It’s really been rewarding of the little things that we’re doing.  Right now we’re doing, or this month was like the Super Bowl theme with the canned food drive.  So we’re collecting — yeah, we’re doing that and we also tried to put in a little office theme event, type thing and kind of just to get you know, because you get distant especially now with remote working and everything else.  So anyway, I commend you on the community service and I think our listeners, if you’re a paralegal that especially I think a paralegal that’s done a lot of things, accomplished a lot of things in your field and maybe you haven’t gone that route, whether it’s even legal related community service it’s fine but even if it’s not, I think that paralegals just naturally have that droll to help others.

Tony Sipp: Exactly.

Jill Francisco: So I encourage our listeners to get out there and do it because it’s amazing what sometimes comes out of it.

Tony Sipp: Yeah.  Your skill sets can transfer to other areas and not necessarily and as you mentioned in the legal field, they can be pretty much anywhere.  I know a lot lawyers who stopped being lawyers and went into a completely different practice, not even a practice just different field.  So it happens with attorneys, paralegals, legal assistants, (00:09:01).  So you know, do what your heart desires and do what you like.  It will come to you as long as you’re happy and you enjoy what you’re doing.

Jill Francisco: It’s perfect.  And I’ll tell you what and I know that — I posted I don’t know on Facebook I posted that last I think it was last Friday, was that February 3?  Was my 26 year as being a paralegal.

Tony Sipp: Wow.

Jill Francisco: And technically, with the same firm because it’s not my fault we got bought out.  I’m counted that I didn’t have to move.  I have not changed jobs and everybody was of course congratulated me and everything but I didn’t put — I just put I’m celebrating being in a profession, working in a profession that I love.  I mean that’s to me the biggest reward that I’ve gotten is that you know, my mom of course you get a lot of advice from your mom and my mom is in a different profession but one of her things that I surely knew is she loved her profession and she loved what she did and I saw that every day.

(00:10:00)

Even when she retired, she didn’t really want to retire.  She could’ve done it forever.  I’m so excited and so blessed that I got into something like that for myself because the amount of time that you devote, and I’m sure you feel the same way.

Tony Sipp: Absolutely.  I joked about my mother-in-law who’s retired but not really because every time we talk to her she’s taking out another job.

Jill Francisco: I thought you retired.

Tony Sipp: I thought you’re done.  I thought you retired.  Just like I am retired.  No, you’re not.  You like what you do and that’s what it is.  She really enjoys what she does.  I mean, she just continues to stay non-retired.

Jill Francisco: Can’t get away from it.

Tony Sipp: No, she can’t.

Jill Francisco: All right.  Well, Tony I think we got to take a quick break here and do some commercial break so we we’ll be right back.  You know those attorneys, the ones who are always on their game, working cases they love, helping people around them and making a great living.  In other words, the attorneys who are building a fulfilling life.  They’re probably using Smokeball.  Smokeball Case Management software takes care of your busy work, automating and organizing your firm and helping you make more money without working more hours so you can focus on what matters.  Get on your game with Smokeball.  Visit smokeball.com to learn more and sign up for your free demo.  Smokeball, run your best firm, build your best life.  Are you ready to level up your career?  Level Up is a free virtual event that gives legal professionals throughout the firm an opportunity to learn new skills, adopt the latest tech, discover ways to be more efficient, improve collaboration and get inspired.  Join InfoTrack on April 27th and 28th at the fifth annual Legal Up virtual conference for information pack sessions, memorable networking, hands-on workshops and more.  Register today at infotrack.com/legalup.

Welcome back to The Paralegal Voice.  I’m your host, Jill Francisco with my new co-host, Tony Sipp.  So I should say I’m a co-host.  I got to get my language down.  So exciting like I said to have Tony here with us and we’re going to continue talking about some stuff.  We gave you a little intro in our first segment there with Tony welcoming to the show and we’re going to kind of now, there are some things that are kind of going on in the paralegal world that I want to just — they just came across my plate so hopefully they’re new and exciting to some of our listeners that we just want to kind of touch on and then if you guys want to know more we’ll give you some information where to go and how to learn more.  But a big thing that’s coming up that I want to just, it was just really posted is the 2023 NALA conference and expo that’s going to take place in Boston always in July, hottest month of the year.  But Boston actually might be comfortable as compared to some of our — like what was it?  Last year in Arizona in the middle of the desert.

So this year it is in Boston.  It’s going to be offered again in virtual and in-person and the dates for that is July 12 through the 14th.  And like I said, NALA really hasn’t done their big formal release yet so I just want to give everybody the heads up but you can go to their website which is nala.org and that is their website and they have registration information because you can actually register right now.  The formal brochure is not out but there’s a list of speakers and topics and all the awesome things that will be offered.  And of course the early bird I think — that’s another reason why I like to bring it up is pricing.  Get in on the best price.  It is offered until May 12 and I think Tony and I are going to try to bring on possibly Vanessa Finley, the CEO of NALA probably maybe early in May before that deadline so we’ll get you a little bit more details and background on the seminar but if you wanted a heads up you can go visit now.  Tony, I think I’ve been every year for 22 years.

Tony Sipp: Wow.

Jill Francisco: Well, I mean, you know, that’s because I was also serving in some capacity too.  I mean the board of directors was 12 years.  So you know how it is.  You got to be there when you’re on the board.

Tony Sipp: Yup.

Jill Francisco: But I know you’ve attended over the years maybe based on geographic or whatever.

Tony Sipp: Exactly.  And a lot of people from LAPA went there as well and they brought their kiddies with them.  And they came back with a lot of knowledge and they shared that with us.

Jill Francisco: Have you done one of the virtuals?

Tony Sipp: I have.  I think it was the year you were coming down or one of those.

Jill Francisco: Yeah.  Because we’ve done it.

Tony Sipp: And it’s good.

(00:15:00)

Jill Francisco: If you’ve done it when it was all only virtual or when it was hybrid that you could have attended in-person because I’m trying to think, I think 20 would have been only virtual because that was (00:15:11) and then 21 was I think only virtual and then last year was both.

Tony Sipp: Okay.  I don’t think I’ve done it on the hybrid model.  I did the virtual model.

Jill Francisco: Awesome.

Tony Sipp: Just traveling and try to get out of work.  That’s a bit of a challenge sometimes.  So yeah, but I enjoy doing and I highly encourage everybody to get involved with that.  You get so much information just being around people and sessions that they have.  So I do encourage that because I heard recently that there’s going to be some changes on the CP exam.  Jill, do you know more about that?

Jill Francisco: Yes.  That’s another thing.  Thanks Tony for bringing that up.  NALA has announced and again, kind of very early they want to give everybody a heads up but if you’re a certified paralegal or you’re not yet a certified paralegal, you might want to look into this because they’re going to have some significant changes that will be effective in January of 2024 and they’re doing that of course to be in compliance with the — they have their accreditation with the NCCA, their standards and things like that.  So that’s going to be — now is kind of like the time.  If you’re somebody that’s been studying and you’re familiar and you’re right ready to go, you might want to go and get your testing in because there will be like I said, there will be announcements, plenty of them from now until leading up to it but those will be in effect in January 2024.

Tony Sipp: Now, are they basing that off of the job report, the survey that they did last year?

Jill Francisco: Yes.  So how it works out is you know, NALA works with PSI and PSI and of course the NCCA standards, they work about and they work together and they think you know, what is actually, we want to keep this test relevant.  We want to keep this test based upon what is actually going on in the field.  What are paralegals doing?  You know, we both know and a lot of our listeners that are working every day, our job changes.  It changes a lot I mean, not with just technology but everything and now remotely and things that maybe really important are now not as important or things that I did all the time now I never do.  And you don’t want — NALA doesn’t want to keep having those things be the emphasis of the test if they are not relevant.  So they do a job analysis.  They did it on November of 2022 and it came out.  I think you can look at this report.  I think it’s public information on the website.  It is the 2022 job analysis report and they surveyed, tells and there the stats that they did.  But they survey paralegals on everything from you know, okay, what area do you work on and based upon the area that you work in, what skills are you using?  You know, do you still do this?  Do you do not do this?  You know, how much of your job?  How much time is spent?  I mean, you know, because that information breaks down the amount of testing and information that will be contained on the test.  Because if it’s something that paralegals don’t really do a lot but you need to know about, you don’t want to have, it would be worth a ton of points or be of emphasis on the test.

So that job analysis report is really good and it’s really accurate and it’s a great way that NALA keeps the test relevant and it’s going to be exciting because as you know, our jobs have changed.  I think about that all the time and so people like I said, it’s a good time for paralegals, if you’ve been studying to maybe go ahead and take the test but if not you know we want to get everybody the heads up that we’re going to have some changes.  I mean, gosh I took the test, when did I take the test?  I graduated from Marshall in the fall of 1994.  Yeah.  And then I think I joined NALA in maybe 2000, 2002 maybe and then I took the test when I was pregnant with my son.  I don’t know why I felt that, that would be a great time for me to take the test.  But you know, that’s when I did it.  So ‘05, so certified in ‘05 and I’ve got the advanced certifications a few years later when they came out.  We had the CLAS, remember that for a while?  And then they changed it to the ACP exam and so the advanced certified paralegal and I think I was one of the first in West Virginia to get — I got trial practice in e-discovery I think which of course are relevant to my job.  But anyway, did you do it long time ago?

Tony Sipp: I did not yet.

Jill Francisco: Oh, oh.  So you’re one of those that — now it’s going to–

Tony Sipp: (00:19:53) I’m one of those that – do it now for (00:19:57).  So yeah, I got to jump on that because, wow.

(00:20:01)

Those changes are going to be significant but what’s great about it though, I was looking over the job report.  Big changes and people in different areas of law like from law firms to let’s see, government.

Jill Francisco: Private practice, yeah.

Tony Sipp: And private and corporate.  Its’ really, really interesting to see the numbers on that and see where people are going and where the job trends are going as well.  It’s very informative.

Jill Francisco: Yeah, I’ve had a lot of — I’d say a few paralegals that I’ve known that, gosh, they’ve gotten the in-house opportunity lately to go in-house and it’s funny even attorneys.  One attorney that I’ve worked with for a while probably 10, 12 years, she just got an opportunity to go in-house for claims, 100% remote for a company in Texas and she lives just across the bridge in Kentucky.  And she’s going to do it for probably a lot of reasons but you know, one, you don’t have to bill for those defense, for those defense apparently goes out there.  Oh my gosh.  Every month, at the end of the month I think why don’t I take another job.  But no, you’re right.  It is very interesting.  So I encourage paralegals to get on to nala.org, look at that job analysis even if that’s nothing to do with thinking about taking the exam.  It’s a useful tool to kind of just see what’s out there and see what your counter parts are doing.  Because like I said, it goes by state, it goes by geographical areas, it’s all sorts of different kinds of the law and it’s super interesting.  All right.  We’ll wrap that up and we got to take another break to thank our sponsors.  We’ll be right back.

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Jill Francisco: Welcome back to The Paralegal Voice.  I’m Jill Francisco and my co-host, Tony Sipp is with me and we were just wrapping up on the announcement of where the CP exam is going to be making some changes.  And so to kind of keep in connection with something else that’s going on that NALA just announced is there have a six-part real estate webinars.  They’re going to be live but they also are going to be available on demand.  So it’s going to be six-part series that starts, I think the first is on February 15th and ending in August of this year.  So kind of spaced out obviously over the months.  And like I said, I think if you purchase all of them as like a bundle that you have the option which is cool for paralegals and you know, our schedules nowadays you can attend live or you can attend on demand whenever is convenient for your schedule and I just bring that up not that I’m trying to sound like a big advertisement for NALA, although sometimes I do.  But I think the reason why I bring that up is because as paralegals, we never know where we’re going to have to change and it might be nothing to do with us and that’s why I know I’ve been on my soapbox before in past episodes about education.  Forever education never really turn it down unless I have 10 other things I’m doing so I can attend because you never know what you’re going to have to do or know or be asked about and I think it just makes you more valuable and it makes you more valuable to your employer which I think is all what ultimately we want to be.  We want to be a contributing valuable member of our legal team and so for instance if you don’t know anything real estate and you think it might be interesting to you or whatever, you never know.

We have like one paralegal at our office that does the real estate, what if something happens to her?  Or she has to take an extended leave of absence, what are they going to do?  I mean, they’re not going to hire somebody so it would be nice if somebody else had some knowledge.

(00:25:00)

So you know, just something for our listeners to think about and kind of always keep your eyes out for things that you can take that are maybe a little bit more involved than a one-hour CLE to get you know, even be able to put on your resume like I feel like you can put that on your resume if you took a six-part series on real estate and specialty, I mean definitely detailed information.  And Tony I’m sure you’ve taken some things like that that helped you out in the long run.

Tony Sipp: Definitely.  We hired a paralegal that was a realtor and went into the real estate and they love her.  Like it just matched it, it matches.  And it’s a skill set like when I do look at the work product it’s different.  It’s different so you have to, you got to know what you’re talking about and if you’re responding to discovery or propounding, it’s something that you should know how to deal.  It’s a unique type of litigation.  So yeah, I highly encourage anybody even if you don’t think you’re going to be going into real estate.  Take it anyway.  It’s worth the knowledge that you gather from that because maybe you want to be a realtor after that.

Jill Francisco: Right.

Tony Sipp: Who knows? It might go the other way.

Jill Francisco: Well, a lot of people do the realty on the side.

Tony Sipp: They do.  They did a lot.

Jill Francisco: Second thing so — but anyway, if you want to know more information of that again, NALA, nala.org at their website like I said, I’m sure they’ll be advertising that and you can find out some more information.  Anyway, so Tony special month, what do we got going on?

Tony Sipp: Well, it is Black History Month so happy Black History Month first of all.  There’s a lot of things going on.  I’m actually going to be doing a panel on the 16th regarding diversity in the workplace.  So if you want to see that, check out my LinkedIn profile it’ll be on there.  But it’s a good time to understand and just if you don’t understand what’s going on and why diversity is so important having a collective group of people that are different from you but the same.  We’ll improve not only your knowledge base but the firm that you’re working with, that you’re working at and it’s a great thing, it’s a sexy term right now but it’s a real term.  It’s real thing that happens like we were talking about earlier, I’m from New York and you’re from PA and that’s diverse.  So I mean you’re going to get — we just grew up that way, right?

Jill Francisco: Yup.

Tony Sipp: But it’s something that not everybody had that experience or had the opportunity to have that experience.  So I highly encourage you and Jill I believe you started the DEI at NALA.

Jill Francisco: Yup.

Tony Sipp: And I started the DEI at LAPA.  So it’s important enough that we engage or re-engage people that have not been engaged and make sure that everybody is included and has a sense of belonging as well with the firm that they’re at because you can have culture of differences but if you’re all doing the same legal work, you can make improvements in streamline and making sure that the equity is there because some of the systems aren’t set up for us so we got to make sure that we include everyone.

Jill Francisco: And like I said, I obviously echo all that you’re saying.  I agree with it and obviously supporting it and it’s important to me but I’ll be honest with you like you said I started with NALA the program and I’ll tell you what, I personally, like you said, I needed to be educated, it wasn’t like right in front of me but I’ll tell you what I did do though is I took the time and talk to people that did encounter those issues and those problems and I listened to them and it literally still gets me emotional because of how they felt in a certain situation because like you said, they did not have the opportunity and there was no reason why they shouldn’t have had the opportunity and it really, really spoke to me.  And so I felt like that I had the voice at that time and that’s also what I encourage listeners to do anywhere that you were at.  If you’re in a position or even if you think — and I’m not talking about like I obviously was the president of NALA, I’m not talking about necessarily being the leader of anything but just having your voice and using your voice and being an ally and even if doesn’t pertain to you personally.  If you understand it and you care about it and you can see how it’s important and affects other people and how it benefited you of why they shouldn’t also have that opportunity to benefit them.  That was my thing I’m like you know like, so-and-so was a great paralegal or so-and-so is whatever and she or he did have that opportunity because they were recognized because they were different or they couldn’t get their foot in the door.  We could go on and on.  And so, like I said, I encourage people to use your voice, to speak up, to do things because even if you think it’s little or small, or it doesn’t’ matter, you’ll be amazed how much it matters.

(00:30:04)

Like the things that people came up and said to me after I got that started I mean it literally brought me to tears sometimes because I was like, they’re thanking me and I’m like — you know, which shouldn’t even have to happen.  I mean, let’s be honest.

Tony Sipp: Yeah.

Jill Francisco: That shouldn’t even have to happen.  I mean, I said you’re welcome because they were showing appreciation to me but I felt bad that they even had to thank me because it should have already been there.

Tony Sipp: We have our implicit biases, all of us do.  And things we just miss like when I was in the government stuff, you’d be surprised how often I would go in the room and nobody else looks like me and they were talking about issues that would hurt me.  I won’t go into it.

Jill Francisco: Right.

Tony Sipp: You understand what I’m saying.

Jill Francisco: And you’re like, am I real?

Tony Sipp: Yeah.  I know like, what just happened here?  And I’m glad that I was in the room though and I took ownership of being in that room and I put my voice out in that room even though they looked at me like, you don’t belong here.

Jill Francisco: Hey, you were at the table.

Tony Sipp: Yeah.

Jill Francisco: That’s the first step.

Tony Sipp: I definitely at the table.  They brought in politicians.  They all went to this me and I’m like, I never knew this happened at all until I got involved.  So I was like, okay.  So, yeah.  Make you voice heard.  Walk in the room like you own it and get out there and start talking to people and just engaging with others that are different from you.  It will enrich your life so much better and improve it.  We could go on about this but I’ll stop there and we can talk about it–

Jill Francisco: No, like I said, I’m glad and I’m glad that like I said, I hate that you’ve had those experiences but I also know that you’ve obviously learned from them and you’ve put a positive spin on them and I think that serves as a way to encourage others to do the same.  And I think that’s one other thing that paralegals possess is encouragement.  We talk about volunteering or we talk about getting involved or we talk about — sometimes that’s all it needs.  Somebody looks to you and says, hey Tony come to this meeting and that’s all you needed.  Or you then since you’re at the table then you encourage somebody else and then all of a sudden you’re not only helping obviously yourself but you’re helping others and I think that’s one thing that sometimes you got to go through the struggle to know but then you learn from it but then it empowers you to share and make sure help others so they don’t maybe have to go through it or you know, that’s a little easier path or something.

Tony Sipp: Right.  Throughout the table, invite them to the table.

Jill Francisco: Yeah.  Exactly.  It is so funny because it’s a simple — it should be so simple but for whatever reason I mean we’re letting this all up.

Tony Sipp: It is the world we are in.

Jill Francisco: No.  And actually, I know you’ve experienced and I’ll tell you what.  I didn’t really have to twist any arms I mean I’ll be honest on my board because I had really good leaders in place on my board but I will say this it opened up I think a lot of people’s eyes.  I think that like you said, the term itself is appealing, you think, oh that’s the thing to do but it was amazing a year out what we saw happening and the changes and the ideas and the direction and the things that came to the forefront that hadn’t been up there because you just had different people.

Tony Sipp: Right.

Jill Francisco: Period.  You just had different people.  You have different people with different experiences, different lives, different upbringing, different geographical I mean all the way different.  Not just looks.

Tony Sipp: Yeah.

Jill Francisco: That’s right.  Not just looks.

Tony Sipp: They attack certain person.

Jill Francisco: And like you said, 10 same people in the room I mean you got to know at some point you’re not going to go forward.  I mean there’s not going to be anything new.

Tony Sipp: Right.  It’s very true.  If I ever get time again, I’ll run again but it makes a difference.  I know I made a difference in that room and I made a difference in my community, things that they were planning on doing.  I’m like, why would I vote on that?  Like in agreeance with you.  Let’s discuss first.

Jill Francisco: It’s mind-boggling.

Tony Sipp: Yeah.  Because it doesn’t — but they’re not even thinking that way.  There’s a reason for that but you have to educate people.  So we educated people.

Jill Francisco: Again, Forever Education.  Whether we’re giving it or getting it, right?

Tony Sipp: You really do, you really do.  Education is key.  Education is definitely key.

Jill Francisco: Yes.  Like I said, happy Black History Month to our listeners and to you Tony I’m super excited that’s awesome and those are important points and we’re going to continue to talk about and bring the DEI element to our discussions, to our table, to our guests, to each other because it’s important and it’s neat because I mean, we’re demonstrating it right now.

(00:35:07)

Like Tony and I are clearly different.  And that’s why though that I hope it’s going to be very successful because we’re different.  And so, anyway, yes.  Thank you so much.  I appreciate all you’ve done for that and like I said, we’re in this together.

Tony Sipp: Yes, we are.

Jill Francisco: And we’re (00:35:26) one now.

Tony Sipp: Very true.  That’s awesome.

Jill Francisco: Anyway, I think it’s time.  Like I said, happily I can say that our time for today is over but not our time.  We’ll be back together before you know it.  So hopefully our listeners enjoyed today and looking forward to hearing both of us.

Tony Sipp: Again, thank you for having me.  I really appreciate it.

Jill Francisco: You are so welcome and I’m so happy you’re permanently.

Tony Sipp: Yes.

Jill Francisco: Totally here.  Sorry, can’t get out of it now.

Tony Sipp: I’m looking forward to it.  We just have great conversations.

Jill Francisco: Yeah.  Anyway, so yeah.  We do have to end for today.  We’re going out off our time, but like I said, we’re going to be looking forward to our future episodes and with Tony and I together and we’re going to get some guests and I encourage anybody reach out to the show, email us, we’re going to be posting our email addresses and they’ll be some information about Tony.  Please reach out to us.  Tell us what topics you’d like us to discuss or guests that you would like us to have or whatever.  We obviously try to get things that are different, that are hot topic but also if anybody has anything else, if you’re a regular listener or a first time listener, whatever it is, we love to hear from you.  Anyway, this is Jill and…

Tony Sipp: Tony Sipp.

Jill Francisco: Signing off for today and we’ll be hearing from you soon.

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Outro: The views expressed by the participants of this program are their own, and do not represent the views of, nor are they endorsed by Legal Talk Network, it’s officers, directors, employees, agents, representatives, shareholders or subsidiaries. None of the content should be considered legal advice.  As always, consult a lawyer.

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