What’s the idea behind an unconference, and could it be a suitable alternative to a traditional conference? In this episode, Dennis Kennedy & Tom Mighell circle back to their thoughts about the need for innovation in the conference arena. They share some common types of unconference approaches and share the pros and cons of these more informal, interactive events. In their second segment, they talk about the utility of a classic whiteboard and how new high-tech versions offer enhanced whiteboard collaboration for users.
As always, stay tuned for the parting shots, that one tip, website, or observation you can use the second the podcast ends.
Have a technology question for Dennis and Tom? Call their Tech Question Hotline at 720-441-6820 for answers to your most burning tech questions.
Special thanks to our sponsors ServeNow and TextExpander.
Mentioned in This Episode
The Kennedy-Mighell Report
The Unconference—A Viable Conference Alternative?
Intro: Web 2.0, Innovation, Trend, Collaboration, Software, Metadata… Got the world turning as fast as it can, hear how technology can help, legally speaking with two of the top legal technology experts, authors and lawyers, Dennis Kennedy and Tom Mighell. Welcome to The Kennedy-Mighell Report here on the Legal Talk Network.
Dennis Kennedy: And welcome to Episode #242 of The Kennedy-Mighell Report. I am Dennis Kennedy in Ann Arbor.
Tom Mighell: And I am Tom Mighell in Dallas. Before we get started, we would like to thank our sponsors.
Thanks first to TextExpander for sponsoring our show. Communicate Smarter with TextExpander. Gather, Perfect, and Share Your Knowledge. Recall your best words instantly and repeatedly. Learn more at textexpander.com/podcast.
Dennis Kennedy: And we would also like to thank ServeNow, a nationwide network of trusted, prescreened process servers. Work with the most professional process servers who have experience with high-volume serves, embrace technology, and understand the litigation process. Visit serve-now.com to learn more.
In our last episode, we discussed the idea of holding personal quarterly retreats and offered some tips on how they might work for you. In this episode, we want to focus on unconferences and my recent experience at Failure Camp, an unconference at Vanderbilt Law School, which was anything but a failure.
Tom, what’s all in our agenda for this episode?
Tom Mighell: Well Dennis in this edition of The Kennedy-Mighell Report, I will be working hard to keep my voice, but we will indeed be discussing the idea of the unconference as an alternative to traditional conferences.
In the second segment, we’ll talk about the value of whiteboarding, including some digital whiteboard tools and as usual, we’ll finish up with our parting shots, that one tip, website or observation that you can start to use the second that this podcast is over.
But first up, the unconference. A few months ago after ABA TECHSHOW, on this very podcast, we discussed the future of the legal technology conference, but we really didn’t get too much into the topic of the unconference and whether it’s a viable alternative to the conferences that we’re used to attending like TECHSHOW, ILTA, Legalweek and the like.
Dennis, you just attended a conference that you just called it, it’s called Failure Camp and I definitely want to learn more about that. Can we start there?
Dennis Kennedy: Yeah. So let me first talk about Failure Camp, which was held at Vanderbilt Law School Cat Moon, Larry Bridgesmith were the hosts of that, really good attendance, probably I would say at least 60 or maybe more people was designed around the notion of a camp, so there was storytelling and there were camp snacks and there was a theme that ran through it.
Art, there was art that you could do, we did murals, we had like camp t-shirts, stuff like that. So it was — it’s kind of fun, I really like the thematic part of it.
So the Failure Camp notion comes from the idea to say well, especially when we talk about innovation, there’s this notion that a lot of things that we try are going to fail, and that’s important for us to realize and it’s important to learn from that and failure can be a difficult thing for lawyers, so it was kind of combining all those elements into this notion of Failure Camp, which could have been called Resilience Camp, because that’s really one of the main things that came out of it.
So it was a really interesting approach and we had lawyers, some paralegals, some legal tech people and others and it was just a really fascinating and very personal experience. So you get to learn a lot about people’s life stories and some of the things that they had gone through and what motivated some of the changes they had made and how they had come back to look at something that at the time felt like a big failure to them, that actually turned out to be a key turning point in their life.
So I don’t know it’s sort of a long explanation Tom, but does that give you a sense of what was going on there?
Tom Mighell: It gives me a sense and I know we’re probably going to talk about it a little bit more in a second, but maybe let’s take a step back and talk about the idea of Failure Camp as an unconference and how it differs from a regular conference.
I mean I’ll start right out and say you said that the crowd was 60, and you characterized that as a pretty good crowd, whereas if I compare that against other conferences, I think that’s pretty small, but the goal for that probably 60 is probably the right amount of people for what it was intended to do.
So maybe we could start with a discussion on what an unconference is and why it’s different from a regular conference?
Dennis Kennedy: Okay. So I think if you had what I would call like the regular conference on failure, you would have a keynote speaker in the morning talking about failure and what it means and you have these panel sessions on different sort of theoretical aspects of failure and maybe from some different perspectives and then the audience would be just sort of listening to a bunch of presentations without a lot of chance for interplay when whereas an unconference, you move away from that structured agenda although they took an interesting approach to speakers here and I’ll talk about the storytelling a little bit later.
But that so everything then became more interactive. So the audience decides the topics they want to talk about, people go off and have discussions with groups of people interested in the same thing, you can move around during them and you actually get to learn from everybody who’s there.
So that’s to me the unconference piece of it; although, there’s — we can talk about those. I think there’s a couple of ways people use unconference these days, but to me the unconference is that notion, like sort of very loosely structured, set the agenda by the attendees, lots of interaction and you kind of go where the day goes with the people there.
And so for me it’s — I learned a lot and it’s fun and in terms of actually getting to interact with the people at the conferences, there’s really nothing like it than the regular conference world.
Tom Mighell: So in getting ready for this podcast I went and I did a little bit of research on the different types of unconferences and maybe I should say different ways of facilitating an unconference and I think that in your notes, you’d mention that there’s two meanings of an unconference, a TED style and an open space model, but if you just go to the basic Wikipedia page for unconference, they will tell you that there are over 10 different ways to hold an unconference.
And I really think that that’s, that’s a little misleading, because when you look at some of these ways they seem to be related to each other and they have a lot in common, but I was struck with the different methods of facilitating an unconference and so I’ll list them real quickly.
One way is what they call the Birds of the Feather, which are more informal discussion groups, sitting around and talking about things. They have the thing that I know I participated in before when we talked about, I want to say either LexThink or BlawgThink which you’re going to talk about later, an unconference that both you and I attended in the past that was, at least part of it was what they call a Dotmocracy, which is voting for topics with dots whoever wants to talk about those things, puts a dot on it and the winner wins, the most number of dots wins.
There’s something called the Fishbowl, where people meet in concentric circles and the people in the middle are the fishbowl and they talk and everybody around listens. Then the rest of them look, and there is a whole bunch of them that are kind of related to the TED Talk style, which is ignite talks or lightning talks, people speaking for five minutes each with a time presentation.
There’s one that I’d never heard of before called a PechaKucha, I hope I’m pronouncing that right but PechaKucha is 20 slides and 20 seconds per slide, so kind of a variation on the lightning talk.
And then it sounds to me like part of Failure Camp was at least what this definition would call either a knowledge cafe or world cafe where people would sit at tables and talk and they’d move around to different tables and there might be facilitators at each table talking about things, which seems to be limited to the final version there, that that was listed. It was called Speed Geeking, which is a little bit like speed dating, but you’re moving from table to table and talking to people.
But I think my long-winded explanation there is kind of my way of saying, there’s a lot of ways to have an unconference and you’re not really bound by anything and I suppose that’s kind of why it’s called an Unconference, you don’t have a lot of rules and there’s a lot of ways to do it.
Dennis Kennedy: Yeah, I think people are so concerned that the traditional conference model is broken fundamentally and that they think that anything that’s an alternative to the standard approach, so I would say like lecture, presentation, longer sessions, focus, not a lot of time for people to interact.
I mean like at some, some conferences you barely get bathroom breaks, it seems like these days, because there’s so much content being pushed at you and so I think there is — that’s why I said, to me there’s — they’re sort of like the two ends of the spectrum.
So one is this sort of modified TED Talk approach where you are saying, let’s do the presentations but we’ll put some kind of time limit on them, and then we’ll throw a bunch of those at people and because it’s sort of like this 60 tapes in 60 minutes notion is like hey, if this one doesn’t work for you then don’t worry because in six minutes there will be another one that you might find really interesting.
And so, there’s that end which I don’t even like as a speaker anymore, Tom. I just — it just wears me out in those things, because everybody runs out of time, it’s a really uncomfortable form of presentation. So I tend not to like those. And then I always got clear to the other end which actually really unnerves a lot of people which is what I call the Open Space Technology approach that Owen Harrison came up with and has this weird name, which really doesn’t have agenda, as like you said people decide what they want to talk about on a large theme typically.
And then you decide who wants to talk about that and you spend the time talking about it. The notion is the whole group together is smarter than anyone presenter and that if you get people talking on things they’re interested in, you potentially get great results.
And so, it’s very loosely facilitated and so I think that what I’ve noticed in these approaches is how much you’re willing to trust your audience to come up with the agenda and then the companion piece of that is if you go to something that has no agenda at all, can you track people to come to it or and can you get somebody to write a check to pay for them to come to it.
So I don’t know that’s – I don’t know Tom, does that kind of reflect your thinking as well?
Tom Mighell: It does and I think but I’ll say that I’m — although I like the idea the unconference, I’m probably a little bit more of a curmudgeon on it, because I think that there’s a lot of uncertainty around it and I think you’ve sort of described part of what it is.
I think that the benefits of a traditional conference are pretty straightforward, although people are unhappy with them. The idea is that many of them you can gain important knowledge that you can take back with them and use in your practice whether it’s substantive legal knowledge, practice management help or whatever.
But with an unconference, you’re relying on the audience to — you are relying on the attendees to give you your takeaway, to give you something to take back with you, and one of my questions about Failure Camp and any unconference is beyond the time spent networking, beyond the time spent making relationships and things like that, what do attendees get and maybe the idea is that they’re not getting knowledge like a regular conference, maybe that’s not the point, maybe the point is to develop things.
For example, with a Failure Camp, I would hesitate to attend to travel all the way to a place to attend a meeting solely on the topic of failure as it applies to innovation. I would be more likely to attend a two-day unconference, where one day talks about innovation in the law and the other one maybe talks about failure or that it’s interwoven somehow, because I don’t really see and granted I wasn’t there and I’m sure you’re going to tell me in a minute, but I don’t really see what the takeaway is from a conference like that unless you are also — this I guess the problem that I have with an unconference is it what’s the next step, what do you do with it.
It’s good that you’re there for the day but there’s a lot riding on what happens afterwards to make the actual unconference a valuable event I think.
Dennis Kennedy: Yeah. So just go back in history a little bit. So Tom, as you mentioned Matt Homann and I put together the LexThink Conference and the BlawgThink Conference was probably getting close to 15 years ago, and the original LexThink Conference we did totally unconference open space style.
And because Matt and I had gone to an open space event a couple months before we just loved it, and one of the things I remembered was just the look of terror in your eyes when you said oh my god there’s no structure, there’s no agenda to this. I got to figure out what’s going on.
And I don’t know whether you recall that, but that’s one of my memories from LexThink. So when we did BlawgThink —
Tom Mighell: Or you may just be making up that memory. But I will let you go do that for the sake of the story.
Dennis Kennedy: I know how comfortable you are when things are unstructured, so you could be right. I know you’re not a big fan of structure. So when we did BlawgThink we said, okay so because people are a little bit nervous, what if we do day one is short presentations with a lot of Q&A.
And so I don’t know if you remember Rick Clow did a whole presentation where he just said — he just asked the audience what questions do you want me to talk about and that was his presentation. So there’s a looseness to it, but there was like okay, we’re going to kind of get everybody up to speed.
The second day was all Open Source, like whatever you came to talk about this is your chance to talk about it. And so I think you can — so these different combinations and I actually like the way the BlawgThink approach worked and that’s what I’ve suggested to people in other settings and you see some echoes of that these days in some different events.
So I think the David Cowen SOLID events, at least the original one kind of fell into almost the BlawgThink type of category, and I think that was great. But to go back to your thinking it’s like what’s the takeaway that’s really interesting.
To me from the LexThink and the BlawgThink Conferences, there are still people I talked to on a regular basis that I might not have known otherwise. I got – there are some projects I’m working on. I’m getting feedback from people that’s directly traceable to those events and there’s some other projects that came out of that.
BlawgThink, there’s definitely one maybe two law firms formed out of that and some other business relationships as well as a longstanding friendship. So that’s what I think is unique about the unconference as opposed to the traditional conference, because you have the chance to actually meet those people.
Tom Mighell: I totally agree with you about that part because remembering those two unconferences, remembering LexThink and BlawgThink, all I can remember that I took away from that was getting to know a lot of great people and being able to network with them.
I don’t remember anything else that I took away from that. I just don’t. And that’s been a while, I don’t remember terror in my eyes either, so I maybe — I maybe blocking out a lot of stuff, but and I don’t know that that’s a negative about the unconference, but I think that’s my one major thing about it is that to be valuable, you have to understand that what you’re going into is, you get out of it what you put into it.
And I think that’s really the critical piece of an unconference is, is that it depends on the attendees to make it a valuable experience and if you’re not willing to put that work into it to do something. And I would guess that also depends what if the attendees don’t know what the heck they’re talking about. What if they — what if somebody dominates the conversation and they’re crazy.
To me, there’s a lot of wild cards. I’m assuming that most of them work out. They worked out when we had ours, when we had those conferences that I went to, but I think there’s — it’s a very interesting concept that has the potential to go wrong and I would say that some of them do and some of them don’t.
Dennis Kennedy: Yeah, I mean I think that part of it is the open space concept, there is this notion of you vote with your feet and so like you can sample the different conversations. If there’s something that’s not working for you, you just go to another one and so like if you have that sort of crazy rambling person dominating something what is going to happen, is they’re going to end up talking to themselves at some point.
So there is that and you would hate — it’s no fun when you think you’ve pitched this really cool idea and you’re the only person in the room. But it just means you go to something else and start talking about that.
So you were talking a little bit about the takeaways. So for me on this one, there was a couple things that might surprise you. So I would say one of my — and I will mention to it, so one was the — I had a lot of conversations about with Millennials about the difference in the way that Millennials approach jobs in the amount of time they stay in them as compared to those of us who are classified with the Boomer generation.
And that was really eye-opening for me and there’s a lot that I know I take from that, that I’ll use in other ways as I kind of confirm some of the things that I was told.
There was also a great set of sessions that came up from the notion of saying — somebody said, you know every time that I hear somebody talk about failure, they talk about the failure and they talk about how things turn around for them and they’re doing something really great now, and usually what they say is, failed then there was this dark period and then everything is great, and they said I would like to talk about this in-between period and what happens when in the thing where you say and then it was dark for a while.
And I actually think that was really valuable for people, because a lot of people in transition are feeling chaos in the whole notion of being in transition and to be around people who’ve been through that or part of it, is really a connecting thing where you can you can learn a lot.
Tom Mighell: So, let’s wrap it up and just say I’m assuming that, you think that an unconference is a risk worth taking, I do too. I think that it really depends on the people putting it on, it depends a lot on the — on the people who are attending like I say, what you get out of it, it depends on what you put into it, but let’s wrap it up Dennis with your final thoughts on I guess the future of unconferences whether or not you think our listeners should attend an unconference if it’s available to them and any parting thoughts.
Dennis Kennedy: So I love unconferences and so the thing for me is that I think that — one things I like is what I call the interaction efficiency of unconferences. So, probably if there were 60 people there I probably had conversations with two-thirds of them and that is like a networking efficiency that you don’t get in any traditional conference, especially if you’re an introvert and I think — I think that’s common and I also like the fact that people actively at the end of these things are saying like hey, how could we continue this conversation, like how — how can we get together, can we do another one and so and again, that’s not — that does not happen at the traditional conference.
So I think that for me I would say that I know that Cat Moon is talking about doing more of these failure camps, and like you said Tom, it might be not your cup of tea, but I think an unconference on a topic that’s really important to you could be an amazing experience for people and I think if you’ve been at these conferences where people are just like slogging presenter after presenter just throwing information at you or these panels where people aren’t totally prepared. The unconferencing just becomes really attractive and even just as, you know, a break from the standard approach, I think it’s worthwhile. I mean, I don’t know. I mean, I know these things would be done with like the very large numbers of people, but I think you really have to have somebody who can facilitate that well, but I think in the setting say anywhere from twenty to a hundred people, I think it’s — I just love the format.
Tom Mighell: All right. Well, that’s it for this segment, let’s take a break for a message from our sponsors before we move on to our next segment.
Advertiser: Looking for a process server you can trust, ServeNow.com is a nationwide network of local prescreened process servers. ServeNow works with the most professional process servers in the industry, connecting your firm with process servers who embrace technology, have experience with high volume serves, and understand the litigation process and rules of properly effectuating service. Find a prescreened process server today. Visit www.serve-now.com.
Dennis Kennedy: TextExpander is a productivity multiplier. Lawyers love TextExpander, because with a short abbreviation or search, while typing, TextExpander can produce cover emails for invoices or signing instructions, insert templates for consistent meeting notes, perform accurate date math on-the-fly, and instantly present things you retype all the time. TextExpander runs on Macs, iPhones, iPads and Windows and works in any application. Visit textexpander.com/podcast for 20% off your first year.
Tom Mighell: And now let’s get back to The Kennedy-Mighell Report, I’m Tom Mighell.
Dennis Kennedy: And I am Dennis Kennedy. In this segment we want to go from low tech to high tech and we’re going to focus on one of our favorite personal group and collaboration tools and that’s the simple whiteboard. I mean, other than the major ink smudging and hand discoloration that I associate with dry erase boards as a left-hander, I find the whiteboard to be an essential tool in almost everything I do these days.
So we want to talk about the utility of whiteboards for us and how there are now tech forms of whiteboards that maybe address some of the drawbacks of whiteboards and open up even more ways for us to use them. Tom, your thoughts.
Tom Mighell: So the historic problem with the whiteboard is that it is fixed in one physical place. So, the only people who can see and interact with them are the ones who happened to be in the room with the whiteboard, and so in response to that you’ve seen a lot of smart whiteboards that have come out, that have made it easy to save off information that you put on a whiteboard and save it off and send it to people, but there haven’t been a lot of tools that allow collaboration outside of the room where the whiteboard lives.
So I’m always interested in having co-authored the book on collaboration with you. I’m always interested in ways of finding better ways to collaborate using a whiteboard and there are two products that I like, one is software, one is physical. The first, the physical one is Google’s Jamboard, not terribly expensive, corporation can afford, it’s a $4,000 or $5,000, it’s not cheap by any means, but it’s not an unaffordable piece of equipment, but it’s a it’s a whiteboard that are like many of the others, but it’s wireless. You can — they call it when you’re doing a meeting or doing something on it you’re — they call it a Jam, you can join a Jam from anywhere, you can join it on your phone, on your tablet, on your computer. If you have the app or if you’re just joining from the web and you can participate in drawing on the whiteboard from wherever you happened to be.
So, I’m intrigued by that, that’s a nice piece of equipment because it’s connected to the Internet and people can participate where they happened to be. If that’s a little pricey for you, so yep that might be pricey, I’ll head all the way down to free and then that’s looking at Microsoft’s Whiteboard Tool, it’s a software solution, it’s totally free, you just download it to your computer or your tablet and then you can share it with anybody in your meeting.
Now because it’s integrated with Microsoft teams, you can pull up a whiteboard in a team’s meeting and everyone can contribute. If you obviously have to have a touch screen to be able to do that, but let us say, a free tool, I’ve used it with many clients on occasion, it’s very good solid whiteboard tool to use and another Microsoft Tool that I’m starting to use is more around capturing a completed whiteboard to save for future reference, we in our meetings will have discussions, we’ll do things on a whiteboard and we need to capture it, so we can take good notes and have a record of the meeting. And I know that’s something you want to talk a little bit more about Dennis.
One of the apps that I use these days is Microsoft’s Office Lens, it’s just a basic scanning app and it’s free to download, but it has the ability to scan an image. You just specify that it’s a whiteboard and when you take a picture of that whiteboard it will automatically straighten it and clean it up, so it’s relatively easy to view and see all the information, it’s a great way to capture all of that, that information to save later if you need it.
But those are the three things that I think are interesting ways of extending the humble whiteboard into more interesting collaborative tools. Dennis, what are you seeing these days in technology in the area of whiteboards that are you’re finding interesting?
Dennis Kennedy: Well, I think that there is a big thing about capture and so frankly there’s nothing easier than just taking a picture of a whiteboard at the end of this session. So, that’s pretty simple. I like what you were describing with Office Lens, of it actually cleaning things up and maybe addressing some of the reflection and other issues.
There is often the issue of people’s terrible handwriting, but that’s — that it sort of is what it is and for me whiteboards there’s a couple things, like finding good dry erase pens, deciding which size fits for you, you have to try smaller and larger ones and the small ones I love the idea of it, but they have never worked for me, so large ones work.
Tom, you know, I have talked about the Rocketbook as a Notebook that you can scan and erase and reuse. They have a new product coming out called Beacons, I think it’s coming out. I can’t really tell that’s currently available, and it allows you to put these four physical markers at the corners of your whiteboard and you can scan it in as you would a Rocketbook page and have all the benefits of that. So that’s sort of interesting.
And then my last idea is I love the conference rooms where there’s a whole wall that’s a whiteboard and so we had some of those at MasterCard and those were great, although you got to make sure that it actually is a dry erase board, because you can, it can really cause some problems if you start drawing all over the wall that’s not a whiteboard. So that’s one thing.
And then I really have been intrigued and I might have mentioned this on our podcast on virtual reality Tom, but I just love the idea that I could use Virtual Reality goggles and sort of have this infinite whiteboard that I could walk around in and write all over the place and I wasn’t limited by size or anything else. I thought that was going to be like — I was almost caught up a patent lawyer, because I thought that was going to be my greatest invention ever but I see that other people had the same idea before.
But so I think the virtual reality could be another way that you can do the whiteboard thing in some interesting ways.
But now, it’s time for our parting shots, that one tip, website our observation you could use the second this podcast ends. Tom, take it away.
Tom Mighell: Okay. I am indeed losing my voice, so I’m going to make this quick. I read an article this past week called, ‘The Hidden Costs of Automated Thinking’, it’s by Jonathan, I think his name is Zittrain. He is a professor at Harvard Law School and he’s a professor of Internet Law and he has a nice article talking about the idea of the intellectual debt that is created as part of artificial intelligence and he compares it to the modern miracles that we’re seeing with medicine, where medicine is able to cure things or make people feel better and we don’t know exactly why it’s happening.
And he compares it to artificial intelligence saying that artificial intelligence is doing a lot of great things for us, but we don’t know exactly why that’s happening and he’s not anti-artificial intelligence here, he just wants us to think about how we’re using it, what we’re using it for and it’s a real thoughtful read on I guess the hidden, what he calls ‘The Hidden Costs of Automated Thinking’. Worth a read. It’s in The New Yorker, I think in this most recent issue, but I’ll make sure that there’s a link up in the show notes.
Dennis Kennedy: Yeah, I think that’s a big issue. We’ve talked about that and e-discovery before. What happens when artificial intelligence is starting to do things that make sense but we don’t understand why.
So I have sort of a 3-part parting shot and so usually we’re thinking about how can technology be improved to make people more efficient and there’s actually some, some tools that look to say how can we make people more efficient and work better with the technology.
And so looking at the people is kind of the choke point. So those of us who can’t type very fast or can’t input data by keyboard as fast as other people, same thing if you’re just disabled. If you can’t — if I can read a lot faster than you, then that has consequences of its own.
So, so three things to think about that I’m going to recommend people take a look at. So one is called Spreed, and it’s a category of tools that allows you to display words in a way either as one word or as a set of words that allow you to crank up your reading speed, just because you’re able to see things at a group that in a grouping that the eye takes in, and you can just crank up the speed those words flash on the screen, and people can double, triple their readings speed with this.
The second one is that we’ve learned that if you’re trying to remember things especially when you’re learning things, you can use the technique called spaced repetition that allows you to essentially use flashcards, but then to start to drop out the ones that you already know and not look at them as often and then spend more time on the stuff that you don’t know, and that you can learn a lot better or more efficiently that way.
So there’s an app called Anki, and then there’s also a website that’s dedicated toward law schools and legal education called spacedrepetition.com, that use this technique. And when I thought about Anki and spacedrepetition.com, with students taking the bar exam, I think this week that I think especially in the last week of studying for the bar exam that type of approach with spaced repetition would be amazingly useful.
So something to look at to say like hey, maybe I don’t need to crank up my technology and maybe I need to crank up me a little bit.
Tom Mighell: And so that wraps it up for this edition of The Kennedy-Mighell Report. Thanks for joining us on the podcast. You can find show notes for this episode at tkmreport.com.
If you like what you hear, please subscribe to our podcast in iTunes or on the Legal Talk Network site, where you can find archives of all of our previous podcasts with transcripts. If you’d like to get in touch with us, remember we have voicemail, we love to get voice messages for our B Segment. Reach out to us on LinkedIn, or leave us that voicemail at (720) 441-6820. That’s (720) 441-6820.
So, until the next podcast, I am Tom Mighell.
Dennis Kennedy: And I am Dennis Kennedy, and you have been listening to The Kennedy-Mighell Report, a podcast on legal technology with an Internet focus.
If you liked what you heard today, please rate us in Apple Podcasts, and we will see you next time for another episode of The Kennedy-Mighell Report on the Legal Talk Network.
Outro: Thanks for listening to The Kennedy-Mighell Report. Check out Dennis and Tom’s book, ‘The Lawyer’s Guide to Collaboration Tools and Technologies: Smart Ways to Work Together’ from ABA Books or Amazon, and join us every other week for another edition of The Kennedy-Mighell Report, only on the Legal Talk Network.