Andrea Liebross is the founder of Andrea Liebross Coaching. She is a certified business and life coach...
Christopher T. Anderson has authored numerous articles and speaks on a wide range of topics, including law...
Published: | January 28, 2025 |
Podcast: | Un-Billable Hour |
Category: | Practice Management , Wellness |
Don’t think of December as the end of the year. Think of it as a chance to plan ahead for an exciting, purposeful, and opportunity-filled new year.
Guest Andrea Liebross is the founder of her own firm, Andrea Liebross Coaching. She believes setting and achieving big audacious goals are best tackled through the implementation of solid systems, real goals, and the right (and ambitious) mindset.
Are you getting where you want to go? Too often, we set our own limits. We stay safe and we stay small. We do things the way we’ve always done them because it’s safe. Hear how setting “big” goals and stretching your thinking helps you become “future you.” Give yourself permission to find out what you really want and where you want to be. And then make a plan to get there.
Learn about Liebross’ “Think Big Toolkit” and the five components that can help you become “future you.” Don’t wait for things to happen to you, make the things you want happen.
Special thanks to our sponsors TimeSolv, CosmoLex, Clio, and Rocket Matter.
Announcer:
Managing your law practice can be challenging, marketing, time management, attracting clients, and all the things besides the cases that you need to do that aren’t billable. Welcome to this edition of the Unbillable Hour, the Law Practice Advisory podcast. This is where you’ll get the information you need from expert guests and host Christopher Anderson here on Legal Talk Network.
Christopher T. Anderson:
Welcome to the Unbillable Hour. I am your host, Christopher Anderson, and today’s episode is about you, completely about you today in the main triangle of what it is that a law firm must do, you will remember that we have to do three things. We have to acquire new clients. Just got to do that. Otherwise, the business kind of goes away. We got to produce the results that we promised them. Otherwise, theBar doesn’t like that, and we have to, and this is the key. Achieve the business and professional results for you, the owners, because you are in the center of that triangle driving it all for better or worse. And so today we’re going to talk about you and we’re going to do that with my guest, Andrea Liebross, whose name I would’ve totally mispronounced as I often do. But she’s the founder of Andrea Liebross Coaching, which she founded with the mission to empower bold, ambitious women entrepreneurs to unlock their unique formula for success in both life and business.
She believes that the secret to thinking big, and we’re going to be talking about thinking big and achieving significant results, lies in two ingredients, implementation of solid systems. That’s the less sexy part, and the cultivating of the right mindset, a big mindset. Andrea also is the bestselling author of She Thinks Big, the Entrepreneurial Woman’s Guide to Moving Past The Messy Middle and Into the Extraordinary. And she also hosts the She Thinks Big podcast. She’s an alumna of Dartmouth, which is near and dear since my wife is as well. Her adventure into this world began when she and the guy who lived down the hall, I love that in your bio, who’s now her husband set out in their red Cadillac traveling from northeast to the Midwest to the Indie 500. And over the years she’s launched three thriving businesses and two thriving kids who are now just out of the nest. And she also has a crew of giant puppies. So Andrea, first of all, I got three questions before we even get started. One is, well, the first one’s not a question. It’s welcome to the show. So welcome.
Andrea Liebross:
Thank you for having me.
Christopher T. Anderson:
Second question is, I mentioned in two different areas in your bio that your book is, she Thinks Big and that you founded Andrea Liebross Coaching with the Mission Empower Bold Women entrepreneurs. So should we tell the men to just get off with you today?
Andrea Liebross:
No, absolutely not. They’re more than welcome. And everything I do applies to them too, especially my clients that are in the legal fields. I often coach men as well. It just happens. But nope, they can listen in, don’t go anywhere.
Christopher T. Anderson:
And you know what? I’m glad you talked about it that way because it’s something I often also encourage people on the show and in life to do is it’s really, really important to know your avatar. In fact, we talked about this before the show and to speak to your avatar, but that doesn’t mean that all your clients will be your avatar.
Andrea Liebross:
A Hundred Percent.
Christopher T. Anderson:
Yeah. And if the same energy that attracts your avatar attracts someone who’s not, that’s a good match. You don’t have to send them away.
Andrea Liebross:
Correct.
Christopher T. Anderson:
And then this third question is the most important I need to know about the puppies. Puppies, what is this in your bio about a crew of giant puppies?
Andrea Liebross:
Well, do you know what a Leon Burger is? A Leon? I don’t. Okay, so we have Leon Burgers, we have two of them. They are about 150 pounds each. Wow. They are, it is a breed in and of itself that came out of Germany in the 18 hundreds, but they’re a mix of a St. Bernard and a Newfoundland Bernie’s mountain dog. So they’re really big. They kind of look like lions. So they have a Maine and the coloring of lions, and that’s sort of this Leon Burger. But they’re long haired. They’re dry mouth, but they’re long hair. They bring in a lot of mulch from outside. They have a ferocious bark, but yet they are super friendly and docile as most people would. Everyone’s like, oh, they sound scary, but they’re not. So they look and sound scary, but they’re not so, and together it’s a lot of energy together when they’re How many? Many? Two.
Christopher T. Anderson:
Okay. Yeah, two.
Andrea Liebross:
Yeah, they’re cousins.
Christopher T. Anderson:
Wonderful.
Andrea Liebross:
The two dogs are cousins. Yes.
Christopher T. Anderson:
I know that every listener’s looking this up as I will be after this show because haven’t heard of them. I love big dogs. I’m in the market myself for a swissy.
Andrea Liebross:
Okay. Yeah. See, they’re kind of friends. That’s like they’re friends. They’re friends. Yeah.
Christopher T. Anderson:
Excellent. Alright, let’s get to the real stuff that we’re talking about though. There’s never anything wrong with talking about puppies. No. Your book that we talked about is called She Thinks Big. Your podcast is the she thinks big podcast thinks big. That’s the words that are repeating itself. So what does thinking big mean as you use it? What do you mean when you’re talking about people thinking big?
Andrea Liebross:
How I see this is we in our day-to-day life where we’re forging ahead, sometimes people say, I’m doing all I can to just get through the day and we’re kind of staying in what I call safe thinking. Or in a way it’s sort of small thinking. We’re staying in our container doing what we know best and how we do it best. And big thinking pushes us really out of that container. It pushes out of us, out of small thinking. It really comes from future. This type of thinking comes from the you of a year from now, two years from now, three years from now versus the you of today. So if we’re a business owner, hopefully we’re in business with aspirations of not necessarily we don’t have to get bigger or generate more revenue or a lot of people want to do that, right? I’m all for it.
But we want growth in some way. Even if it’s just personal growth, you want to be a better attorney. That could be the goal in and of itself, or you want to grow the firm or whatever it is. That type of thinking is coming from future you and that future you is also the one that thinks big. So I like to say, you need to go meet future. You need to go talk to the person three years from now who has a firm that’s generating more revenue or is really working with their ideal client. Or you become master, not master.
Christopher T. Anderson:
You’re talking about the meta physically meeting, the future. You’re talking about like go find this person.
Andrea Liebross:
Yeah, go in your mind. This is all in your mind. So this is all about mindset. Like you said, systems, that’s kind of the less sexy part of this whole thing. Mindsets the better part. So this is all in your mind. Go talk to future you in your head and ask them she what to do today. So if you were a person who had the more revenue, bigger firm, better at your craft, what would they do today? If you were already that person in the future, what would they do today? How would they answer the question? Should I or shouldn’t I invest in this today? You is going to answer that. Well, I don’t know. Can our budget handle it? Okay, the future you probably would say, yeah, if that’s going to help you get here faster, let’s go for it. Let’s trust. So I like to also say that big thinking if sometimes people say, well, what do big thinkers do? They trust, and I use trust as an acronym, T-R-U-S-T. So I’ve got T stands for this, R stands for that. So they trust that this kind of first person, this future you can actually come into fruition can become a reality. And we can get into what all those T-R-U-S-D stands for too. Yeah,
Christopher T. Anderson:
Because I mean, it’s funny because a lot of people often say, if you could go back .10 Years, 20 years and tell yourself, give yourself some warnings, give yourself some advice, what would you say? And I think people can really picture that, right? Because they know who they were or they kind of remember who they were and they know who they are. And there are probably some things they’d like to maybe suggest maybe you shouldn’t have that third martini on that day, or maybe stay away from Julia, she’s the wrong one, or
Andrea Liebross:
Whatever. Don’t get two dogs, just get one too much,
Christopher T. Anderson:
For instance. But what you’re saying is you can have that conversation.
Andrea Liebross:
You can already have the conversation. So my kids are in this age of where they’re going for jobs and getting interviewed. And my son said to me the other day, they asked me what would I have told my he’s only 23, go back to when you were 18. What would you have told your 18-year-old self? Kind of the same sort of thing. So I am a proponent of, you can already have that. He at 23 can already have a conversation with the 28-year-old him and ask the 20-year-old and what should he do today in this job interview? Right? So that’s the kind of thing, that’s what I’m talking about.
Christopher T. Anderson:
I don’t want to get stuck on this point, but I think, and it is funny, what’s cool about what you just said is you didn’t say he can go talk to the 53-year-old him.
Andrea Liebross:
No,
Christopher T. Anderson:
Because he really doesn’t have any idea who that guy is. But he can talk to the, you just said five years, 28.
Andrea Liebross:
Yeah,
Christopher T. Anderson:
We can picture where we want to be in five years. And then have a conversation with that woman, with that man and say, dude, what should I do? And it will come into clarity. I mean, there is some clarity there because it’s not so far away.
Andrea Liebross:
No,
Christopher T. Anderson:
I think that’s amazing. Amazing advice. So how did you come to this? How did you bring this into your life, into your work
Andrea Liebross:
Now? It’s probably like eight years ago, I worked for, I was an employee, so I was working for someone where I was doing their recruiting and hiring and training. What I realized was that I would recruit people to, it was kind of almost like franchises in a way, but it wasn’t, we could get into the technicalities of that. I would recruit new business owners to ultimately open a franchise. They would do that. I would be in it with them what the corporate entity was calling training. So I would now help them start, get the thing rolling. And then they got to a point where I like to now call it the messy middle, where the fun wore off, the excitement was over. They were successful. They were seeing dollars roll in, they were seeing themselves getting the clients they wanted to, but it felt really heavy and it felt like, should I keep going? Is this really what I want to do? A lot of them were women. So thus my focus on women,
Christopher T. Anderson:
This
Andrea Liebross:
Was taking time away from their family or so they thought too much time away from their family and they were stuck in this present where they were in the present moment and it felt heavy. So I realized that in order to get past that, they had to go back to their why they said yes in the first place,
Which was their idea that they could have a business that was thriving, live the life they wanted to live. And they had to go back and ask that person how to move forward from this messy middle moment. And that’s kind of where this concept started to evolve. And then I eventually left that company. I had had enough of, the big joke was if I had one more great idea that they said, oh, that’s a great idea. And then it didn’t turn into anything. I was out. So I’d had too many of those kind of conversations. So I was out and I started my own coaching practice because what I realized is this training piece, what they were calling training was really coaching. So then when I was coaching my own people, I started to use this kind of concept of future you and asking future you what to do. And that really was big earth thinking than they were having in the moment. And that’s how it evolved.
Christopher T. Anderson:
Yeah, that makes sense.
Andrea Liebross:
Yeah.
Christopher T. Anderson:
So Future Me is telling me that our sponsors want to be heard. So we’re going to give them a chance the folks that make this show possible to give their messages. And we’re going to come back right after that. And I want to talk to you about, you’ve developed a Think big toolkit and I want to talk a little bit about that with some recommendations to how people can use this toolkit to embrace big thinking, to get used to it. We’ll do that right after we hear from these sponsors. And we are back with Andrea. She is the founder of Andrea Liebross Coaching. When we finished, we were talking about Thinking Big when we said we were going to talk in this segment about the Think big toolkit. What tools or strategies would you suggest that someone who wants to, who’s listening to us and going like, yeah, I need to have this conversation. I need to think big. What tools would you recommend that they begin to use to embrace that?
Andrea Liebross:
So the toolkit is actually a literal thing. So you could go access the toolkit if you wanted to at AndreaLiebross.com/toolkit. I bet someone will put that in the show notes. But really those tools in there are going to help you do five things. Number one is all big thinkers know that they have thought options. So this kind of goes back to that acronym of trust. So the T and trust stands for thought options. And what I mean by that are you can, with any circumstance in your life, you’ve got options on how you want to think about it. Okay, so we’re recording this, like you said, at the end of December, middle of December. So you could really be thinking about December as the end of the year, or you could think about it as the perfect time to plan 2025. Or you could think about it as, I’m just going to take a break from everything and check on out and I’m going to enjoy the holidays with my family.
So you’ve got options of how you want to think about just the month of December. And I like to say too that that’s almost like you’ve got, you’re at a wedding, for example, and there’s a guy walking around with past hors d’oeuvres and he comes up to you and says, take one. And he puts that tray in front of you, and you look at the tray and you decide, should I have the bruschetta? Should I have the spinach square? Should I have the shrimp? That’s like a tray of options. You’ve got choices. So you have choices of how you want to think about things. So inside that toolkit, that’s one tool that you need to get good at, recognizing that you’ve got thought options. Second thing you’ve got, the tool you need to have in your toolbox is R. The R and trust stands for real problem. The real problem, 99.9999% of the time isn’t really a problem at all. It’s just a feeling that you don’t want to have.
Okay, so let’s say we’ve got, I’m going to put this in. Air codes a tough client. This person’s impossible. No matter what I do, it’s not good enough. I’m not working fast enough for them. They’re haunting me. Are they really a tough client or are they a problem? Or do you just not like the feeling that you’re getting when you’re working with them, putting you on the spot? They’re asking you questions, they’re demanding and you’re feeling inadequate. You’re feeling you’re being put on the spot. You’re feeling in a way bombarded. So the problem is just the feeling. They’re not a problem. They’re just a human. So I like big thinkers, recognize that there really usually isn’t a problem. It’s just a feeling that you don’t want to have. So a lot of times when I’m working with my clients, they’re giving me this big, long backstory. This happened, this happened, this happened. What do we think I should do? And so then I’m like, wait, wait, what’s the problem? Can we identify the problem? And most of the time, I mean they could identify a problem, but it’s really the feeling that’s attached to whatever that situation is. That’s the problem. So that’s kind of the second thing.
Christopher T. Anderson:
And then from the first thing, I just want to kind of wrap it back. They have a choice about how they feel about it
Andrea Liebross:
A hundred percent.
Christopher T. Anderson:
And if they just choose to feel differently, like, listen, I don’t want to ever lend ourselves to magical thinking. And if we’re going to get to that here,
Andrea Liebross:
This isn’t about, we can’t just sprinkle some fairy dust and it all goes away. That’s not happening.
Christopher T. Anderson:
But once you choose to feel differently about it, then the actions become clearer. The thought without actions is nonsense, but then the actions become clearer and you can start to march down a road that will help you feel differently.
Andrea Liebross:
A hundred percent. Yes. Exactly.
Christopher T. Anderson:
Cool. Well, everybody’s wondering what you is,
Andrea Liebross:
Okay. I mean, this is so exciting. So U stands for uncertainty or the unknown, and big thinkers need to embrace uncertainty and the unknown. So we’re human. We like predictability. We like a plan. We want to know what to expect. However, we honestly never know what’s going to happen. We don’t know what’s going to happen this afternoon, even though you and I both have things on our digital calendars here. How is it all going to go down? Who knows? So big thinkers have to be okay with that unknown or that uncertainty because if they’re not, otherwise, you kind of stay in your small box and you probably don’t take any risks,
Right? You’re not willing to put yourself out there. You’re not willing to say yes. You’re not willing to take a chance on something. So you’ve got to get really good at embracing the unknown or uncertainty. And I think in the legal field, a lot of times I’ll with small business owners, small practice owners, they’ll kind of say, do we think we need to bring on another lawyer or do we just need a paralegal? Or what do we need? I don’t know. Do we have enough work to support them? What’s going to have, if we, do we going to give them partnership? Are they going to be in a partnership track? How should we handle it? There’s so many questions. We don’t have the answers actually to all of those questions. We can create some hypotheses, we can create a rough plan. Is it actually going to roll out like that? Probably not. So you’ve got to get really good at being okay with that uncertainty and that unknown. And that’s another tool. That skillset is another tool that needs to be in your toolbox.
Christopher T. Anderson:
And in fact, I mean, I think you would agree with me that in fact, trying to insist on more certainty in those situations is actually a defense mechanism to avoid fear, to avoid the, I’m always circling back to avoid a feeling of discomfort that you don’t want to have.
Andrea Liebross:
Correct. And I love to say, so we all say things like, I’m just going to think about it.
That’s a common, okay. So a lot of times, say for example, I’ll be on a consult call and I’ll say, all right, so here’s how I think I can help you. We could do this, this, and this. And what do you think? Oh, sounds, Andrea, this is perfect. Great. I think I should move forward. But I’m just going to think about it a little bit. I’m just going to think about it. Okay. I clearly am all about thinking, right? But my follow up to that is always, what exactly are you thinking about? What is the question you’re trying to answer for yourself? No one has a great answer to that.
Christopher T. Anderson:
No, because they’re not going to think about it,
Andrea Liebross:
Right? It’s really, they’re just trying to become more comfortable with saying yes to something where they don’t exactly know how it’s all going to turn out. It’s just trying to quell their brain and quiet it down when it’s chirping and saying things like, are you sure you should do that? I mean, you’ve never done this before. Who makes this Andrea person worth it? Is she really worth it? What have other people experienced? So that kind of thing.
Christopher T. Anderson:
Sure.
Andrea Liebross:
So if you find yourself saying, I’m going to think about it a lot, if that’s a common phrase that you’ve got, I want you to ask yourself, what exactly are you thinking about,
Christopher T. Anderson:
Right? Yeah. Because it doesn’t have to be you or somebody who wants you to make a decision. It’s the question you should be asking yourself. Whenever you think I’m going to think about, I’m going to stew on that. I want to sit on that. I want to sleep on it. Yeah. It’s like, what are you going to be thinking about? I think that’s great. So yeah. So that takes care of the uncertainty portion of it. All right? Yes. We’re deep in now we’re three.
Andrea Liebross:
We’re deep. We’re going deep.
Christopher T. Anderson:
Three letters in.
Andrea Liebross:
Okay, so we’re up to S. You ready for S?
Christopher T. Anderson:
I think we all are.
Andrea Liebross:
All right. S is secure support. All big thinkers. I don’t know any big thinker out there. We could even use big thinkers in society. Elon Musk, Steve Jobs, all those people, they all have a support system, a support team, support resources.
So I find a lot of small business owners thinking that they should be able to figure everything out on their own. Or if I’m so smart, why can’t I figure this out? Or I could do this myself. They, they get stuck in the weeds and they’re doing things that aren’t worth their pay grade, we’ll call it, right? So who is supporting you? What is supporting you? And are you good at delegating? Are you good at seeking advice? Are you good at seeking support and securing it and actually making use of it? So that’s something that I think all big thinkers get really good at, and they’re willing to invest time, money, energy people into that support category.
Christopher T. Anderson:
But I think you’d also agree with me that among entrepreneurs who haven’t really adopted or embraced big thinking yet who are getting there, this is one of the hardest ones.
Andrea Liebross:
I think this is probably the hardest one. Yeah,
Christopher T. Anderson:
The
Andrea Liebross:
Hardest one.
Christopher T. Anderson:
Usually by the time you’ve started a business and you’ve gotten to a certain stage, you’re okay with uncertainty. Most people, or you’re getting there.
Andrea Liebross:
You probably wouldn’t have become an entrepreneur if you weren’t a little bit, right? But,
Christopher T. Anderson:
But I need help. Whoa.
Andrea Liebross:
That’s
Christopher T. Anderson:
The tough one.
Andrea Liebross:
And even help, I think it becomes, it’s easier to say, I need help from an administrative standpoint, that kind of thing, but help thinking things through or help thinking about what your next move is going to be. That’s support too. And there’s support out there for that. And I think a lot of times we rely on, like I say, passive action or passive support. So you’re listening to a podcast, which clearly I like podcasts, or you’re reading a book, I’m all in on books. But that sort of passive action, are you taking massive action to secure support? Are you actually literally making moves to have a conversation with someone? Are you putting yourself in rooms full of big thinkers?
Christopher T. Anderson:
That
Andrea Liebross:
Kind of thing.
Christopher T. Anderson:
So to recap, thought options is the first T about a real problem, which is really a feeling that you don’t want to have embracing uncertainty. That’s the u and s, making sure you have secure support.
And now I never get to do this on the show. We’re going to do a cliffhanger. We’re going to come back after these messages from our sponsors with the final T. I never get to do it. It’s so exciting. And talk to Andrea about what the final T is, and then we’re going to talk a little bit about some misconceptions about big thinking. So to make sure that we don’t get stuck in the wrong thinking about big thinking. But first, a quick word from our sponsors. We are back with Andrea, and we’ve been talking about the think big toolkit. We’ve been talking about thinking big. We got through TRUS, thought options, real problem, uncertainty, secure support, and we’re up to that final T. Andrea, what is the last item from this Think big toolkit? The five things about Thinking Big? Yes.
Andrea Liebross:
The last T stands for take action, which I gave you a little sneak preview in that secure support. So we have 60,000 thoughts ish a day.
Christopher T. Anderson:
Whoa.
Andrea Liebross:
Yeah. So 60,000 plus thoughts a day as humans. That’s a lot of thoughts. That’s a lot of thinking. But are we taking action? Are we actually making the move? Are we doing something with those thoughts? So I see a lot of people, a lot of business owners, they can be big thinkers. They could also be small thinkers. They can take small actions, but they’re not taking big action.
They’re, I call it dancing around the bigger thing. Okay, this actually just happened this morning. I was coaching someone and we’re working on her 2025 plan. This is perfect. Okay. So we’re working on the plan, and I kind of do it in a way where we talk about what’s her vision? It’s kind of a two part situation. What’s the vision? What’s the vision for 10 years out, three years out? What’s the vision of where you want to be next year by this time? Okay, now let’s switch the switch it and go into the action steps you need to take. And we break it down, what do we need to do this quarter? What do we want to do next quarter, et cetera. And I noticed that all of these, so I had her do her homework and come to the meeting prepared everything. She had put dates on of I want this done by this date, this day’s, this date. It was all between now and February 15th. That’s
Christopher T. Anderson:
What we do.
Andrea Liebross:
Okay. Right. So great. I’m glad you’re going to be really busy over the next eight weeks, super duper. But what’s happening after that? She said, oh, I don’t know. I just got to get these things in order that I’ve listed out here in the next eight weeks, and then I’ll be great, then I can move forward. And then I don’t know, we’ll figure it out. So that’s a really good example of her being willing to take small action. And they were things like, I need to get a better onboarding system for clients. I need to finish the reviewing the copy on the website. I need to make sure that my QuickBooks is up to date. They were almost really tasky types of things. And I said, yeah, but if we want to get to this and this place by next December, we need to start taking some bigger actions. Those
Christopher T. Anderson:
Are pain points. She’s just eliminating pain points.
Andrea Liebross:
Right? Exactly. She’s just eliminating pain points. So you as a business owner, you’ve got to check yourself and are you just in the practice of eliminating pain points or taking these small actions, or are you thinking about what’s happening in July and what you want to happen in July and taking actions to get to that place now? Right. Probably going to, I like to say, you got to backtrack. If you want to be there in July, what do we need to do? Yeah,
Christopher T. Anderson:
What do we need to do by June? What do we need to do by May?
Andrea Liebross:
Right? May. And this was hard. This was hard. She needed really a guide. As soon as I started prompting and kind of okay walking her through the steps, she’s totally able to do it. But the comfort place was like, what’s happening between now and February 15th?
Christopher T. Anderson:
Exactly.
Andrea Liebross:
And
Christopher T. Anderson:
Then there’s also a really big danger in that I found, I want your reaction to this, but I think everybody’s heard, or most people have heard the expression, but it’s really true that as humans, we tend to overestimate what we can accomplish in the short term, in the term of a day or a month
Andrea Liebross:
Or a couple months,
Christopher T. Anderson:
And then grossly underestimate what we can actually get done in a year. The problem with that is if we overestimate what we can get done in that short term and then we make this list for
Andrea Liebross:
Eight weeks,
Christopher T. Anderson:
Chances are we’re not going to get it all done, which will lead to a of defeat, which will stop us, which will slow us down because we’re like, oh, I can’t even get those things.
Andrea Liebross:
No, no, you’re so
Christopher T. Anderson:
Rich. And meanwhile, we’ve got no North Star. We’ve got no longer term plan for the things that happen after that.
Andrea Liebross:
Yes, I’m on your team. Totally. So one of the exercises that I sometimes even start with clients. So someone comes to me and they’re like, I think I want to work with you, but I’m not sure. So let’s start with this vision to action intensive where this is you and I sitting down and mapping out what’s your vision and what’s your actions. And in that process, I make you dig deeper. This is what I want to accomplish in this eight weeks. Okay, let’s go even deeper. I want you to think about each thing and break it down into 10 parts. And when each of those things happening within the eight weeks. Well, once someone starts to do that, oh, I think I’ve bitten off more than I can chew even in eight weeks. I mean, nothing’s happening that week of December 25th, or I’m going on vacation. We’re going to The Bahamas over New Year’s. They start to think about this. So they are setting themselves up for feeling that feeling okay, that feeling of defeat, or if I can’t even get this done, how am I going to get something bigger done? And it kind of spirals. So you end up staying stuck in what I call that messy middle.
Getting granular on these things is very important. And when you get granular, you are then giving yourself that space or that runway to think about the bigger moves. Perfect. Yeah.
Christopher T. Anderson:
I’m sure that when you talk about thinking big and you bring this concept forward, there are out there misconceptions, people that think about thinking big that cause them to be discouraged.
Andrea Liebross:
Yes.
Christopher T. Anderson:
What are some of those and how do you address them?
Andrea Liebross:
I think a big one is being resigned to the thought of, in this season of life, I can’t take on anymore. I’m just trying to get through the day. Or I’ve got little kids. And sometimes people’s families actually in their heads are getting in the way.
I’ve got little kids. My family is my priority right now, and I’m not growing this firm. We’re just going to stay just where we are. And I always say, what if both were possible? Are you giving equal airtime to you could be parent of the year and grow the firm? What if both? What if it’s not an either or? It’s an and situation. They’re like, really? I could do? Yeah. Okay. Tell me more about that. So I think what gets in the way of big thinking, I mean, ultimately it’s ourselves, right? But it’s sometimes this thought of in this season of life or where I’m at right now at max capacity, and I can’t take on one more thing, it’s just impossible. So that’s something that gets in the way.
Christopher T. Anderson:
And what if five years from now you has a bigger firm and works less?
Andrea Liebross:
Imagine that, right?
Christopher T. Anderson:
What would they tell you to do?
Andrea Liebross:
Yes. What would that person So true. So true.
Christopher T. Anderson:
So let’s leave our listeners as we come to the end here then with if someone is, because what we’ve just gone through, quite honestly, it’s a lot.
Andrea Liebross:
It’s a lot.
Christopher T. Anderson:
Even the T-R-U-S-T, that’s a lot. So if it feels overwhelming to someone who’s listening to us, let’s leave our listeners today with some action that they can take to start shifting their perspective. Where would you recommend they get started?
Andrea Liebross:
One thing that I see people really struggle with is deciding how they should spend the hours in the day. And that gets in the way of big thinking. So I would love for your listeners to really think about what are the things that they are doing that only they can do for real, not just because you wouldn’t like how someone else was doing it. Are they working in what I call their zone of extraordinary achievement? So in that toolkit, literally in the toolkit there is I’ve created this matrix zone of extraordinary achievement matrix where it really helps you kind of break down what only you should be doing and what other people could be doing, and is whatever this thing is actually moving the needle forward. So talk about addressing the pain points versus moving the needle forward and creating that future that you want. Because a lot of times we’re stuck in the weeds of something that’s not so important. This kind of matrix really helps you sort out, is this moving me or my business forward? Is this something that only I could do? Or really could someone else do it? And is this something that I enjoy doing that lights me up? Or is it something that is kind of like a black hole? And then the last thing, is this something that I really even need to know how to do? Do I really need to know how to work the backend of the website? Not really. Or do I need to produce the podcast? I definitely don’t need to produce the podcast.
Christopher T. Anderson:
And newsflash for all our listeners, the list of the things that only you can do is really small.
Andrea Liebross:
It is. I know that’s like the spoiler, right? Yeah. Or good news. The list of the things that only you can do is really small.
Christopher T. Anderson:
No, it is great. It’s great news because with that, that’s how we can move forward. So I think that’s a great first step.
Andrea Liebross:
You’ve got to create some space for yourself to engage in this kind of thinking. I like to say sometimes the best part of what the work I do is I’m holding space for people to think in this way. That’s the biggest gift you can give yourself. So yeah, see what you can, especially as we enter this new year, what could you clear off your plate so that you’re only working in your zone?
Christopher T. Anderson:
And you don’t have to answer the questions of who could do it.
Andrea Liebross:
No, you not. You don’t have
Christopher T. Anderson:
To answer the questions of when would they do it or how do I find it, or any of that. Just start with the questions that Andrea suggested. What could someone else theoretically do?
Andrea Liebross:
Yeah. And start to get okay with the unknown. I always use the analogy of folding the towels. Is there anyone else in the world that could fold your towels? Oh, yes, there are, but they’re not going to do it the way I do it. Does it really matter?
Christopher T. Anderson:
Right.
Andrea Liebross:
So you have to get comfortable with the unknown of how they might fold the towels. It’s okay. It’s okay.
Christopher T. Anderson:
There is a right way, just so we know. Alright, well that brings us to the end. We have to wrap up this edition of The Unbillable Hour. I want to thank our listeners for hanging out here with us today. Our guest today has been Andrea Liebross and she’s the founder of Andrea Liebross Coaching. And as I mentioned before, she’s also written the bestselling book. She Thinks Big, the Entrepreneurial Woman’s Guide to Moving Past The Messy Middle and Into the Extraordinary and hosts the She Thinks Big podcast, which you should listen to all the time after you listen to this one
Andrea Liebross:
Should be next on the playlist.
Christopher T. Anderson:
There you go, Andrea. If people, this half hour went so fast, if people want to learn more or get in touch, how can they learn more about you? Your book, your podcast, your coaching? How do they reach out?
Andrea Liebross:
I think the easiest way is I’ve got one link that links to all the things. So Andrea is with an S, links with an s, Andreas links.com. It’s going to link you to the book, to the podcast, to the toolkit. There’s also a quiz on there, which might be really helpful for those of us that are trying to figure out what should I be thinking bigger about what stage am I at, et cetera, et cetera. So go take the quiz too and download that toolkit. Andrea is with an S, links with an s.com. I’m also on LinkedIn and Instagram and all the things.
Christopher T. Anderson:
Perfect. Thank you so very much.
Andrea Liebross:
You’re welcome.
Christopher T. Anderson:
Of course. This is Christopher T Anderson, and I look forward to being with all of you next month with another great guest as we learn more about topics that help us build the law firm business that works for you. Please also remember that on the third Thursday of every month at 3:00 PM Eastern, there is the community table where you can come on the show live and ask us questions. In fact, I’m going to put you on the spot right now. Andrea, would you be willing to come on the community table and ask and answer questions from some of our listeners? Sure.
Andrea Liebross:
That would actually be fun.
Christopher T. Anderson:
Great. One of the community tables coming up soon, we will have Andrea and she will also answer your questions. And remember also that on the Community Table website here at the unbillable hour, you can also post your questions if you can’t make the show live, and we will answer them and then you can listen. So you don’t have to be there live. But being there lives is better. There are follow-up questions we’re going to ask you. We’re going to drill deeper and really get to the core of the issue. But Community Table every third Thursday, live at 3:00 PM Eastern, 12 o’clock Pacific. That’s one o’clock Mountain and two o’clock central. And then of course, remember, you can subscribe to all the additions of this podcast@legaltalknetwork.com or on iTunes. Thanks for joining us. We will speak again soon.
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