Legal Tech, The End Of The Law As We Know It?

Episode Notes

Transcript

Speaker 1:

Managing your law practice can be challenging, marketing, time management, attracting clients, and all the things besides the cases that you need to do that aren’t billable. Welcome to this edition of the Unbillable Hour, the Law Practice Advisory podcast. This is where you’ll get the information you need from expert guests and host Christopher Anderson here on Legal Talk Network.

Christopher Anderson:

Welcome to the Unbillable Hour. I am your host, Christopher Anderson, and today’s episode is about, well, we’re going to leave that one open this time, which is unusual for us because today’s topic quite honestly touches everything. We are back to legal technology. I know we just talked with Jared last show, but we’re looking at it from a completely different perspective today. And even though it’s two shows in a row what we’re going to talk about today, I was willing to bring back another technology topic because quite honestly, it’s damn important and we need to be paying attention to this. We’re going to be speaking today with Colin Levy about recent and accelerating trends that will be and already are a part of how we work. And we don’t have a choice about this. It’s going, it’s happening and we have to get with the program as a reminder in the main triangle of what it is we do in our law firm businesses is we must acquire new clients.

We call that acquisition. We produce the results that we promise that’s production, and then we achieve the business and professional results for the owners of the business. And that is all about the center of the triangle, which is you for better or worse. And honestly, what we’re going to be talking with Colin about today, it touches all three points of the triangle and and we’re going to discuss how these tech trends are and will be affecting your law firm business. As I mentioned, my guest today is Colin Levy and he’s the author of the legal tech ecosystem and he’s also director of legal for a company called Malbec. And we’ll be hearing a little bit about that here as well. And we’re call today’s episode the End of the Law as we know it. And I’m just sort of stealing from another great author, Richard Susskind on that, and Colin and Richard, nothing to do with each other, and I think I’ve changed that enough to not have a copyright issue with Richard, but if we do, he’ll call me.

Things are changing and they’re changing fast. And to use the words from the singularity, the rate of the acceleration is in fact accelerating. And so we’ve got this double square acceleration and I want to really kind of dive into that with Colin. Colin has been named to the prestigious fast case 50 list of legal innovators. He’s a well-known tech expert. He’s a corporate lawyer and he’s frequently on lists of people to follow for learning about legal tech online. And indeed the book, his book the Legal Tech Ecosystem is a great source for that. He’s also the editor of The Handbook of Legal Tech published by Globe Law and Business, and he’s contributing articles and on podcasts and we’ve managed to get him to come on the unbillable hour. He’s also the director of Legal for Malbec, which is a leading contract management company, and he served in numerous prominent legal roles for companies in the tech industry for over a decade. He’s got a certificate for legal innovation and technology from Suffolk University Law School. He’s got his JD from Boston College and a BA in Public Policy and Law with honors from Trinity College in Hartford. Colin, it’s an abbreviated introduction, but I’ll let you kind of expound on it a little bit. But let me just welcome you to the show.

Colin Levy:

Thanks so much for having me. It’s really a pleasure to be here. And yeah, you described me quite well in that brief introduction.

Christopher Anderson:

Not at all. Really, really happy to have you. So let’s just get started. I mentioned the book, the Legal Tech Ecosystem. Let’s just start with why did you write this book and what are you hoping to help readers? Who should read the book? Why did you write it and what are you trying to bring across?

Colin Levy:

Sure. So I wrote the book out of Desired Inform and inspire people about legal tech. That is something that I’ve long been passionate about through my writing and speaking efforts. And the book really is aimed at legal professionals of all backgrounds who have a desire to learn about what it means to be a tech enabled legal professional regardless of your career status and position. Because let’s face it, technology’s everywhere. It’s becoming increasingly important and impactful in all areas of professional life as well as some areas of personal life. And so I think that this book is intended to be a accessible high level introduction to the world of legal tech, and a lot of it is focused on my own journey and my conversations with others who have been engaged in their own journeys through this really amazing space.

Christopher Anderson:

Cool. And one of the things that you write about a phrase that really stuck out to me because in my work with other lawyers across the country, I see, and when I go to legal tech shows like ABA Tech Show or Con or Legal Week and others, the various state bars, I find a lot of lawyers going out there and they’re shopping and they’re looking at technology. They think it’s kind of like a gym membership. They think if they plunk down the dollars that they’re going to get buff if they plunk down the dollars and buy this new gizmo or that new software that it’s going to in quite honestly some sort of magical way revolutionize their business. And that bothers me. And then this phrase you wrote was that technology alone is not sufficient. And so I thought we might spend a couple minutes about what you mean by that and how, I love the word the phrase you used. Now I’m going to botch it so you tell me what the phrase was. But it was like technology enabled lawyer. What does it mean for a technology enabled lawyer that technology alone is not sufficient?

Colin Levy:

The way I look at technology in general is it by itself is just another set of tools, but any set of tools, the real value in the tool comes not from its sole existence but from it being used. And so ultimately with respect to technology and any type of tech tool, the users are those who’ve derived the value from the tools, meaning that having technology in place is one thing, but actually having it being used and being used by the right people in the right ways is really where the value comes from. Which leads into the idea that I talk about that unutilized the book and my view of legal tech in general is this ecosystem of people, process and tech all working together and all interdependent upon one another. So technology by itself, yeah, it’s great. It’s very cool that we continue to come up with new inventions and new different types of solutions, but these solutions themselves aren’t doing anything. It’s them being used that actually achieves results. And so that’s why I talk about technology not being sufficient and not being enough. It’s really up to individual people to be using those tools for there to be value realized.

Christopher Anderson:

When you’re thinking about this and you say you’re utilizing the tools as important, what comes first? Sort of a chicken and egg question. Do you buy tech to augment your process or do you allow your process to be developed by the technology that you choose?

Colin Levy:

In most cases, what tends to be the approach that I’ve seen is you have a process in place and it needs to be augmented or improved. And so you use tech to improve that process, but to figure out whether it’s a process improvement that you’re after or whether the tech can actually reimagine your process, which also was quite possible and I’ve seen a number of times, it depends on what problem it is you’re trying to solve. I think that if you’re evaluating technology tools for use as a possible solution, you have to know what you’re trying to solve for. And I’ve seen too often the case where people don’t know what their problem is, but think that tech can solve some problem that they have without defining what that problem is. And what ends up happening is they have tech put in place that then either doesn’t get used or makes an existing problem worse or even worse than that creates a new problem that they didn’t have before that was created as a result of the tech. So that’s why it really starts with understanding your people and your process first before you move over to tech because tech is amazing and cool, but it’s not the solution to every problem and it can’t fix every problem.

Christopher Anderson:

And also the way you just described it makes it sound like it’s a little bit iterative. You have a process, you augment it with some tech, which highlights some possible opportunities for more augmentation and back and forth a little bit. But indeed defining the problem first is key. So before I want to move on to a little bit more pragmatic questions regarding how to actually implement it, but I just wanted just touch on the title of the book. You didn’t write everything you need to know about Legal Tech. You wrote legal tech ecosystem, and I just want to kind of peel that back a little bit. What do you mean by ecosystem? Why is that important for the readers in modern law practices today?

Colin Levy:

Absolutely. So the way I kind of came up with this title and approach it is legal tech is like any ecosystem composed of different members that are interdependent upon one another and impact one another. You’ve got people impacting processes, you’ve got processes impacting people, you’ve got processes impacting tech, and you have tech impacting processes and people. And so all of them together make up this ecosystem. And that’s why I kind of titled the book the Legal Tech Ecosystem and why I talk about legal tech as an ecosystem, it really is one and it’s evolving, but it also needs support. It needs to be given the proper attention and be given the proper support. So it really is dependent upon all these different members functioning effectively, not just with each other, but in an interconnected way because they are interconnected and all really depend upon one another to be successful.

Christopher Anderson:

Okay, well that really makes sense. Alright, we’re going to take a break here. We’ve got these sponsors who want to be heard from too. When we come back, we’ve kind of set up what the book is and what it’s about. We’re going to go a little bit pragmatic. I want to ask you some questions about how this is actually going to be changing things, but first a word from our sponsors and we’ll be right back. All right, we are back with Colin Levy and we’re talking about his book, the Legal Tech Ecosystem. So my next question for you, Colin, is what do you see as the future? How is AI as part of this tech changing the future of dispute resolution? And of course you mentioned you’re working now at Malbec with contract drafting, so how is it affecting that? I imagine it has effect in both places, but let’s talk about both. So let’s start with dispute resolution. How can AI or how is AI affecting dispute resolution?

Colin Levy:

Sure. Artificial intelligence in general is, let’s be honest, impacting so many different areas of professional life and personal life with respect to dispute resolution. There are a number of different ways in which it is impacting that. First of all, if you are potentially in the middle or potentially contemplating a Litigation or moving forward with a Litigation matter, there are now tools that can help you figure out the best types of arguments that perhaps will be most successful. You can test out different legal theories and arguments and see what the AI suggests in terms of what may be more helpful based off of accessible data and historical data and case law. It also can be very helpful with respect to kind of figuring out what makes more sense in terms of how to put together a legal argument and a brief or what have you. So there are a lot of different areas in which AI is helping people resolve disputes.

It’s also helping people avoid disputes altogether by giving them some information with respect to, yeah, this probably isn’t worth litigating because either it’s going to be unsuccessful or it’s going to be too costly or some other reason you’re just not going to get very far with it or what have you. So that could be, I think very interesting. And again, this is all just based off of data and a lot of data that AI is using to derive trends and analytics from. That’s pretty exciting. With respect to more of my wheelhouse contracts, AI is helping in a variety of different ways, including helping figure out how to draft potential clauses, negotiate an agreement in a better way that gets you to where you want to be quicker or faster or else can help you review agreements faster and figure out, okay, what’s okay, what’s not okay, what’s missing, what’s not missing?

All of these things can be done by humans, but often as time consuming and repetitive and data-driven and for those reasons are very actually great use cases for artificial intelligence. And now that we have artificial intelligence that’s super accessible in the form of generative ai, you now can access AI through just speaking or writing to it and have sort of instant feedback and instant guidance. And that’s very helpful I think as well. Ultimately it’s making I think the lawyer’s life more productive, more efficient, but it’s also kind of asking the question of what it means to be a lawyer and what it means to be practicing law because the role of the lawyer is changing thanks to the rise of artificial intelligence.

Christopher Anderson:

Let’s go into that a little bit, especially since you’re interacting with it at that level. What are client’s expectations? So lawyers are using ai, like you said, for contract drafting, from making language decisions, doing contract review to highlight problematic areas or things that might need changing. Things that 10 years ago were all just total intellectual pursuit. It was like lawyer reading and noting and recommending, and now we’re using AI to augment that, but then we’re passing the advice off as lawyers. What’s going on with client’s expectations around that and how is that impacting lawyers, what it means to be a lawyer?

Colin Levy:

Sure. Well, I’ll start first with the client expectations in general, and I think this has historically been the case. Clients have been more apt to be aware of what’s going on in the tech space than lawyers in general because of their resistance to change and at one time fear of technology. So I certainly think that that is part of it. And clients now are expecting lawyers and law firms and legal departments to be more tech savvy, be more data-driven and kind of meet them where they are in terms of their level of awareness of technology and desire for technology to be used by those that they’re seeking help from. As for lawyers, I think lawyers now in many ways are under the gun with respect to being more tech savvy, understanding how technology can help them practice law. And as we’ve seen in 40 plus states at this point, there now is an ethical duty to be aware of the relevant benefits and risks of technology as maybe pertinent to their individual practice.

And that really is a very lawyerly way of saying that you got to get with the program here, pun intended, and be aware of what technology may be useful as well as its potential risks in using it. But ultimately, in terms of what lawyers do going forward, they’re going to be more analytical and likely going to be performing things that are augmented by the use of technology. And I use the word augment specifically because I think that there has been a little bit of talk of technology kind of replacing people and we are not at that point yet, but we are at the point where technology is replacing tasks and redefining certain jobs and also creating new jobs. So to that end, certainly the lawyers, I think of the future and going forward at least that are going to be most successful will be those that successfully integrate technology into their practice and use it to augment how they work, which will be good for the lawyer in some ways because it will save them time, allow ’em to be more productive and allow them to make better use of their time on more valuable work rather than doing a number of things, some of which are valuable, some of which they have to do, but may not necessarily be bringing a whole lot of value to themselves or their business.

Christopher Anderson:

And I guess one of the concerns since we’re just kind of right here at the interface of how lawyers are using the AI is it’s almost impossible to remember that chat GPT was released a year ago, right? I mean it’s like it’s about one year, 12 months, it’s a short, short time ago and it’s already gone through a couple of iterations, each of which is a huge advancement. And that’s just one aspect. I mean, chat PT is not, AI is not the entirety of ai, it’s just one little teeny aspect of it. This pace of change, how you’re talking about, oh, we’ve got to get with the program, but by the time we’re with the program, it ain’t the program anymore. What is a lawyer to do to, I won’t even say bother saying stay ahead of it, but to keep up in a way that’s meaningful to their clients and also makes them compliant with 1.1. How can you keep up with something that’s changing so fast?

Colin Levy:

So I think you’re exactly right in that you shouldn’t be trying to keep pace with technology because just not possible. What is possible is keeping it always inside ahead of you, in other words, knowing where it is with respect to your relative position and more specifically artificial intelligence tools and other types of tools are going to continue to improve and grow more powerful. So I think really what that means for each of us individually is first of all, we need to be open to adaptation and learning and experimenting. In other words, using these tools now will give us a validation we can build off of as these tools evolve. Because now that they’re out there, they’re going to have more capabilities, but the basic foundation of them won’t change. And that’s been the case with a lot of different technologies that the foundation of a lot of technologies hasn’t changed, but what has changed is the number of functionality that these different solutions can offer and how they can do them and how quickly they can do them.

So really ground yourself in the basics first and then use that as a foundation for learning and growth. I think another thing that’s really incumbent upon lawyers to do with respect to technology is not try to cover the water firm with trying to understand everything all at once, but rather understand what is most pertinent to your practice. In other words, what type of practice do you have? Is it Litigation, is it more transactional? And then use that to guide you with respect to what potential tools you look at that are more focused on those specific areas of your work. And then taking a step back, I would also suggest that before you even do that, look at what tools you use now and see how can you use those more effectively because likely those tools have improved themselves as well. I’m talking about word, Excel, whatever. Those tools also likely have improved in functionality. And so there likely are functions you’re not aware of or not using effectively that you could be using that could make a world of difference in your practice. So it doesn’t, learning about technology and experimenting with it doesn’t always mean just trying out what is new right now, but what has existed that you just used but haven’t been using to the full extent of its capabilities.

Christopher Anderson:

Yeah, no, that makes total sense. I think we all use 10% of word or Excel, not all, but most of us use a very small fraction of what the capabilities actually are. And that’s a great place to start. We’ve come a long way since clippy in Microsoft Word. Alright, so what we’re going to do here, I want to take another break. Let’s hear from our sponsors. And when we come back I want to again change our conversation a little bit. I want to cover first of all, what is digital transformation because it’s something you write about as far as the importance of data and what digital transformation means. And we’ll have some follow up about that. But first a word from our sponsors. Welcome back. We are talking with Colin Levy and he’s the author of the legal tech ecosystem and he’s the director of legal for Malbec, what should we call that? It’s a contract review and development company,

Colin Levy:

Contract management, company contract

Christopher Anderson:

Management. And so he’s leading those efforts, but we’re talking to him today about legal technology and we just finished having a really cool conversation about ai and I wanted to kind of shift again because not all AI these days, that seems to be if someone says tech, everybody says AI and there’s other stuff going on. And so one of the questions I wanted to ask you here about was you write in the book about the importance of data and how legal departments are encountering digital transformation. But I wanted to start with what is digital transformation? What is this process that is going on with these legal departments and law firms across the country?

Colin Levy:

Yeah, so digital transformation really starts with understanding that the world is a digital one these days and it thrives on data. So to meet the needs of a digital world, you have to be digital yourself. And what that means more specifically is you have to be acting in a digital first way. IE making use of tools that digitize data, digitize documents. Basically everything operates in a way that is seamless, where data from one thing you’re doing, it flows into another thing you’re doing and everything is aligned. And that really ultimately ends up taking the form of a tech stack of different tools that all are communicating with one another, working effectively, working seamlessly and all supplementing each other and you being able to sort of captain it and figure out where you want to take things and what’s going on at any given time and use that data to then drive how you act, how you work, and what you can do to help others on your team and your business overall.

And that sounds great and it is, but it’s hard work. It’s hard work, it’s time consuming, and it requires focus, consistency, and really taking a people first approach. While yes, digitization is the ultimate goal, it really starts with people understanding them, meeting them where they are and helping them change as you want them to change because you can’t force people to change. You can try, but it often doesn’t end up working well. You have to kind of bring them along for the journey and make them understand that the change you want to see is a change that they would want to see themselves. It will help them as much, will help you leading the team.

Christopher Anderson:

You mentioned data, everything’s digital. How can we leverage that more effectively in using these tools? How is this digital transformation really about getting value out of the data we’ve already got?

Colin Levy:

I think the problem in law, generally speaking when it comes to data is that to your point, there’s been a lot of data that they have collected, but it’s all scattered all over the place and it’s not collected in what’s called a structured way IEA way that’s logical and that makes sense for a tech tool to make use of. And so in order to make use of that data you to understand first of all what data you have. So understanding a landscape of art, what’s our area of focus, what’s our business focused on? What are we collecting data on? Asking the question, why are we collecting data on all these different things? What’s the purpose? And then use that purpose then define how you go about them making use of the data, okay, this set of data, I don’t know why we collected it, it’s not really useful for us.

We at one point thought it was going to be useful, but it’s not. So let’s just get not focused on that. Let’s focus on this set of data and okay, this data, I’m sure it can tell us a lot, but it’s a boatload of data. I dunno what to make of it. So let’s find the tool that is focused on making use of this set of data and then providing that data to the tool and then having the tool tell us, okay, this is the data we have, these are the trends, these are the analytics that we have that can help us dictate we’re spending X amount of time on this, it would make more sense to spend more time on this. So let’s see if we can automate this because it’s taking too much time and not providing as much value to ourselves or our clients or we’ve been working on this and it’s just not showing a whole lot of results or giving us the return.

So let’s see what we can do to improve it. Or this process is broken because we have people involved in it and it’s leading and it seems like it’s working, but that’s only an assumption and that assumption is wrong based off of data. So let’s see what we can do to improve it. It’s all about really structuring the data in a way that is actionable. And that starts with, again, understanding the data that you have, understand your reasons for collecting it and seeing if those are reasons align with your business goals because not all data is the same. And data often has been called by some the new gold, but some of it is fool’s goal, some of it is not valuable at all. And really all that depends on the context in which you are looking at the data and the type of data and how you’re collecting it. And sometimes you may be collecting not enough of the right type of data and too much of the wrong type of data. So that is also a thing to look at.

Christopher Anderson:

So what’s a lawyer faced with, okay, I’ve got this heap and pile of data, where do I start? What tools can I even think about to help me get to wrangle it?

Colin Levy:

So that depends on, I think partly what your area of expertise is in. If you’re a litigator or a Litigation firm, look for tools that a Litigation analytics focus that can then collect all that data and provide you analytics based off of your Litigation XV for transactional, look at say perhaps a contract management solution or even a workflow automation solution that can help you organize your data and organize your tasks. It can better be more productive and make better use of that data. And quite frankly, look, I get it, we’re all busy people, so I don’t necessarily recommend that you, the individual as the head of your law firm or head of your legal department, be the one tasked with doing this. That’s why you have folks like legal operations folks who can help you find the right tools for you, help you figure out how you’re collecting data, where that data is going, whether it’s valuable data and all of that. So this is a team effort and it requires different levels of expertise from different types of people. And again, that’s why I mentioned legal operations as potential folks you can turn to for help in this area as well as outside consultants as well. But often I think the best approach is to have a legal operations function that can handle this among a variety of other tasks for you.

Christopher Anderson:

That totally makes sense. So I want to hit on a couple key topics before we run to the end of the show because I think there’s are really, really interesting thoughts that you offer in the book. The first one is you talk about legal technology, which is what we’ve been talking about, and you talk about innovation and you say it’s important to distinguish between those two concepts. What is the difference and why should we be considering that? There is one,

Colin Levy:

I’ll be the first one to tell you that innovation can definitely be facilitated and helped by technology. However, they’re not the same thing you can innovate with or without technology. And I think the ways in which that can happen is, for example, suppose you have a business with a process where it involves a bunch of different steps and a bunch of different people involved in that process, but the process is often slow or things often go awry. But look, you might be able to just think about ways to improve that process through process improvement techniques, which can lead to innovating a new process that might be more effective for performing that work that needs to get done. And that may require or involve technology may not. It may just be a people problem where you just have the wrong people or not enough of the right people or too many people or whatever involved in the process.

So that’s one example of an innovation that doesn’t necessarily involve technology. Another is one in which you could perhaps have an idea for improving company culture. Suppose the sales team and legal team don’t necessarily always align. They’re not always communicating with one another. Something I did in a prior role was I started a sales education program where I myself would engage with the sales team on a monthly basis where I would talk about different topics that I was interested in and working on that related to what they were doing and related to how I helped them. And that allowed us to both align and therefore have a better working relationship and being more collaborative. And that’s a relatively simple innovation that doesn’t require technology involved at all. It just involves basically being collaborative and being more transparent in learning from others. And so I think that’s important to keep in mind with respect to innovation is that innovation is a great thing, but it doesn’t have to be some super complex thing or super technological thing either.

Christopher Anderson:

That makes sense. So we’ve talked this whole show about your book pretty much and about technology and artificial intelligence and the effect of that on law firms and the gold and fool’s gold of data. What we didn’t talk about much, I just didn’t want to let you go before we at least give a minute to your work at Malbec for legal departments that are looking for contract management solutions, what should they be thinking about and all the stuff we just talked about, how does that align and focus into contract management?

Colin Levy:

Look legal departments, I’ve been in a variety of different legal departments of all different sizes, many of which do not have a contract management solution. And it was very challenging because you’re dealing with a lot of different documents and keeping track of the status of different documents, what version is which, who’s touched which document, whose red line is it, is this the final version? The final final version, oh wait, now we working off the wrong version. How many contracts have we done this month or this quarter? What are often the pain points with these contracts? All those different data points are things that a contracting management solution can help with in terms of helping to enable better deal flow, helping enable better tracking of metrics, help enable better tracking of versions and controlling versions, helping ensure that the right people are touching the right version of the contract and seeing who last touched it.

And all of this can be done without even having to leave whatever solution you’re in because the beauty of contract management solutions is they integrate into existing solutions. So suppose you’re working in Salesforce, you don’t have to leave Salesforce to work in Malbec. You can work within the same platform but have the benefit of Malbec working with you. So ultimately, contract management solutions basically help take the pain out of contract management and make it a more data-driven, more productive, more collaborative function as it should be because lawyers shouldn’t be the only ones involved in contracts because contracts underlie so much of what business is all about.

Christopher Anderson:

They define relationships, right?

Colin Levy:

Yeah. And involves sales, involves finance, involves everyone. So really it should be a collaborative exercise in good contract manage solutions enable that collaboration. That’s really what Malbec is all about, is enabling that collaboration through a seamless, intuitive platform.

Christopher Anderson:

Alright, so you and I, Colin have talked today about so many things. We talked about technology writ large, we’ve talked about AI and we’ve talked about data and data transformation. If you in 30 seconds could say what a key takeaway of your book or what our conversation has been, what should listeners walk away from today as their main thought?

Colin Levy:

Sure. I think the main takeaway is that tech itself is, as you quoted me earlier, is not sufficient tech plus people, plus processes where the real value lies.

Christopher Anderson:

Excellent. I think that is a great place to leave it. We have to leave it because that wraps up this edition of Unbillable Hour. So thank you for all our listeners for listening. And thank you Colin, for being our guest today. Our guest today has been Colin Levy. He is the author of the Legal Tech Ecosystem and the director of Legal for Malbec. Colin, if folks want to learn more from you about what we’ve talked about, whether it be about mybe or about the legal tech ecosystem or just questions about technology, what’s a great way for people to get in touch with you?

Colin Levy:

I am very visible on LinkedIn, so that’s one way. Another way is through my website, call s levy.com, that’s C-O-L-I-N-S-L-E-V y.com. And I’m also on Twitter slash x or slash whatever you want to call it, C Levy Law. That’s CLEY law LEW. And also, please do check out my book on Amazon, the legal Gold Tech ecosystem.

Christopher Anderson:

Yeah, yeah, it is on Amazon indeed. Thank you, Colin. Thank you very much.

Colin Levy:

Thank you very

Christopher Anderson:

Much. You bet. And of course, I am Christopher, T Anderson, and I look forward to seeing, listening, hearing, or being heard by all of you next month with another great guest as we learn more about topics that help us build the law firm business that works for you. And it wouldn’t be right of me to forget to mention, so I won’t that you have another opportunity to engage with the Unbillable hour at the community table every third Thursday at 3:00 PM Eastern, we have the community table and at the community table you can join. There’s a Zoom link and you can join in and be part of the conversation, ask your questions about your law firm and have them answered by me and by guests. That’ll also join us at the Community Table, again, third Thursdays at three, and you can subscribe to that show and this show and to all the additions of this [email protected] or on iTunes. Thanks for joining us. We’ll be speaking again soon.

Speaker 1:

The views expressed by the participants of this program are their own and do not represent the views of nor are they endorsed by Legal Talk Network, its officers, directors, employees, agents, representatives, shareholders, and subsidiaries. None of the content should be considered legal advice. As always, consult a lawyer. Thanks for listening to the Unbillable Hour, the Law Practice Advisory podcast. Join us again for the next edition right here with Legal Talk Network.

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