Is This the Golden Age of Podcasting?

Episode Notes

Transcript

Kennedy-Mighell Report: Is This the Golden Age of Podcasting? – 8/5/2015

Advertiser: Got the world turning as fast as it can? Hear how technology can help – legally speaking. With two of the top legal technology experts, authors, and lawyers: Dennis Kennedy and Tom Mighell. Welcome to the Kennedy-Mighell report, here on the Legal Talk Network.

Dennis Kennedy: And welcome to episode 156 of the Kennedy-Mighell Report. I’m Dennis Kennedy in St. Louis.

Tom Mighell: And I’m Tom Mighell in Dallas.

Dennis Kennedy: In our last episode we discussed the upcoming Windows version 10, and the Windows platform in general. In this episode, we want to talk about a recent meme on podcasts, namely the general belief – it seems these days – that we’ve entered the golden age of podcasting. Tom, what’s on my agenda for this episode?

Tom Mighell: Well Dennis, in this edition of the Kennedy-Mighell Report, we will be discussing whether or not we are indeed in a golden age of podcasting or maybe this is just some idea cooked up by a media to generate additional news. In our second segment, we will check in with Dennis about his experience so far with the Apple watch. And as usual, we’ll end with our parting shots, that one tip, website or observation that you can start to use the second that this podcast is over. But first, let’s talk about the notion that we are in what some are calling the golden age of podcasting. The idea itself of podcasting – it’s been around for a while. It’s been around for well over ten years, and it seems like it’s only now that people are – I guess the mainstream people are – really starting to pay attention to podcasting. You and I, Dennis, have been podcasting I think 7 years now. We started in 2007 or 2008 somewhere.

Dennis Kennedy: It could be 2006, even.

Tom Mighell: It seems like old news to us, frankly. But, Dennis, are we in a golden age? Or do you find that most people still don’t know what podcasts are?

Dennis Kennedy: Well, I Googled it, “the golden age of podcasting,” and recently there have been a lot of comments referring to a golden age of podcasting.

Tom Mighell: I Googled, “resurgence of podcasting,” and got a similar number of hits.

Dennis Kennedy: So that is sort of interesting and I think that’s why we decided to talk about it. Because one, it always seems like when something hits the golden age, it seems like we’ve been involved in it for a long time. I think we were recently talking about the golden age of blogging, and it always seems like we’re a little bit before that. It would be nice if we hit things in the golden age. Our appearance was made at the golden age but it always seems like it’s something that comes well after we’ve been into these things. So for me, I can point to one thing that I think led to this, and that’s the Serial podcast, which became a phenomenon. And I know, Tom, you listen to it. I actually did not listen to those podcasts.

Tom Mighell: What?

Dennis Kennedy: It’s not my subject matter.

Tom Mighell: You mean the law is not your subject matter?

Dennis Kennedy: I get a lot of law at work.

Tom Mighell: It’s criminal! You get a lot of criminal law and murder at work. It’s very interesting! Okay.

Dennis Kennedy: It’s not totally my thing but I think that there was so much interest in that, it got people thinking about podcasts but I think in a distorted way. Because I think it has that fabulous MPR production value, it’s done its stories, and it really started to make people think that podcasts are this form of radio that’s downloadable. You can listen to it when you want, all kind of classic podcasting traits. But they’re very professional radio stories – perhaps an extended form – with a beginning, middle and end. A little bit of mystery with professional podcasters behind it. So I think that pulled people in but I think that gives people a distorted view of what podcasting is. But to me, that’s what I point to that led to the resurgence of podcasting.

Tom Mighell: So I’m going to agree with you that the Serial podcast was a catalyst in what might be a resurgence or golden age of podcasting. But I’m going to argue that actually what was the cause of it and that is something that is newer now than it was when podcasting first came out is the idea that content – whether it’s video content or audio content – can be recorded in a different way and made available in a different way. We’re all consuming things on Netflix now, on Hulu. We’re looking at YouTube videos; we’re not looking at broadcast TV as much. People are consuming information in different ways. When they saw that they could do the same exact thing with audio, I think that had a lot to do with it; as to say look, this is a way that we can in asynchronous time, and we don’t have to worry about when it’s actually broadcast. We can download these programs and we can listen to them at our leisure. What I thought was interesting after Serial ended was I started to see a lot of articles out there that were very similar to what you might see with people who watch shows like Orange is the New Black or House of Cards on Netflix. Now that you’ve finished Serial, here are other podcasts that you can binge listen to. And it was all about trying to catch up on a story. And I think that kind of leads to – what I would call – the distortion that people think all podcasts are like Serial; which is unfortunate because Serial’s a fantastically produced podcast, it’s professionally done, but it tells a coherent story. And I would tell you that probably most of the podcasts I listen to are only Serials and that they come regularly. But they are not necessarily telling a coherent story. So I think that to a certain extent there’s distortion, but I also like the fact that Serial, for whatever it’s worth, has gotten more people interested in the idea of podcasts. And I think we’re actually seeing more and more podcasts and more people doing podcasts than we’ve ever seen.

Dennis Kennedy:You’re right, we’ve moved onto this on demand world, and it’s sort of rare that I listen to radio anymore. But you’re just blown away by how much there is of commercials and stuff. It’s really hard to say you use it, I just want to hear a story, I just want to get the news or whatever. Same thing watching TV where it seems like the commercial blocks are four minutes long and it’s almost impossible to watch TV without DVRing it. So I think that was an appeal to people and then I think the content providers – and I think MPR’s done a fabulous job with podcasts. But to repurpose stories, combined shows, there’s really high quality content out there and it’s really well produced. I think the big things in those also are the growth of podcast networks so you can find a bunch of related podcasts that are good all in one place, so that’s easier to find. The tools to both produce podcasts and to find them and listen to them have gotten better. And I think, Tom, we’re also seeing in the legal world and elsewhere that the marketing strategists are pointing to podcasts as a great way to market products and services.

Tom Mighell: Well as you pointed out on a podcast – on our podcast – a number of weeks ago, you were pointing out Dave Winer’s new notion of the 5-minute podcast and making the argument that it might make more sense to actually go online and record a 5 minute discussion rather than write a blog post on it. Maybe marketing strategists are having that same idea that hearing a lawyer talk about things has more intimacy of learning who that person is as they talk about things. I don’t disagree that that might be something that people are thinking a lot more of. Although I will say, having just written an article about podcasting, it’s not easy to find podcasts by lawyers that are regular, that they’re regularly doing, or that they’re of a quality that I might want to recommend. I would say that I could count only about – notwithstanding, I think the podcasts on the Legal Talk Network are all very well produced, they are regular content. Once you get outside of that network structure, I probably couldn’t count more than ten legal-related podcasts that I might recommend to friends to take a look at if they were interested in law-related podcasts. So I’ll come back to and ask you the question: What else has changed? We’ve talked about podcasting on this show before. What has changed since the last time we talked about it – in terms of podcasting – that might be worth mentioning?

Dennis Kennedy: Well, I think what’s changed is people have figured out ways to make money off podcasting. So you see in the networks, you see that people are coming up with making a part of marketing strategy. Also like you say, it is hard to write a blog, especially over a sustained period of time. And I think that both of us now find it a lot easier to do podcasts than to blog or even to write articles at this point. So all of those have given us appeal. And then also I think that it’s the smartphone world, so that you say, now with my smartphone, I can download podcasts – once I learn how to do that – and I can play it in my car, I can work out, because I have this one device that does everything that’s with me all the time. And I can find podcasts or have podcasts recommended to me that fit my commute, my workout time, or I may have more extended things. And Tom, you and I – probably me even more than you are – are at the extreme of using podcasts because I think they’re incredibly valuable. And I think it’s really opened the world of the audio lurkers. People learn and they like to learn things in different ways and they like to consume content in different ways. I’m clearly an audio person; a lot of people I know are video people, but you can’t watch video in your car, obviously, until we get driverless cars. So I think that those things have come together and is that sort of TiVo notion, DVR notion that we get radio content but we can shift it to the time we want to use it and we can get it on demand. So even like MPR and stuff do point to the notion – ESPN as well – do point to this notion that you can get the content you want and listen to it at the time that’s most convenient to you. And I think that’s what’s really caught on with podcasting.

Tom Mighell: I think so too. And we ask the question, is this really the golden age of podcasting? To me, golden age suggests that it’ll never be this way again; that we’ve hit the apex or the height of the age of podcasting. And I guess I would prefer to think about this as maybe the renaissance of podcasting. That it’s a rebirth that people are finding new interests in it, and by finding new interests in it, maybe we find new ways to deliver information, to consume information, to share information and do it through the audio format rather than a written format. I think that there’s a lot of good possibilities that are out there. Do you have recommendations for lawyers who might want to think about a podcast? What kind of advice would you give them if somebody – heaven forbid – emailed the show and

Dennis Kennedy: There are a couple of things, and I think what could happen when you focus too much on Serial, as the classic example of a podcast, is that you lose the sense of diversity of all the different things that podcasts can do. And I still look back on some of the earliest days of podcasts when Denise Howell was doing a podcast while stuck on a freeway in California, just talking in the crappiest recording device you can imagine. Steven Dembo in Chicago would do the same thing, “I’m doing a podcast while I’m driving home from work,” and it was utterly compelling stuff. Now I don’t think you can do that stuff because it’s harder to do that because sound quality does matter. But I think that people don’t have a sense of all the variety. So even if you look at the Legal Talk Network, our show’s sort of unique because we don’t do interviews; it’s just the two of us talking in a structured format. You have the interview shows, you have recordings of live events and seminars that are turned into podcasts. ESPN does shows, MPR does shows or segments of shows. BBC has a lot of different content, there’s panel discussions, there’s author readings, talk shows. I love the thing that you were talking about in reference to Orange is the New Black, that podcasts are just a panel of people right after a TV show is on talking about the latest episode. There’s just a whole variety of content out there and approaches in podcasts and I think that people don’t totally realize. So I worry a little bit as we move in; marketing people are suggesting that podcasting could be a good thing for lawyers. I think they could, but I worry that in the blog world, people are saying you need to do “X” format and not do these things. I think whether we’re in the golden age or not, we’re still at a time of experimentation where you could really try a bunch of different things. So that’s what I would say. If you’re thinking about doing a podcast, you’ve got to listen to a lot of different podcasts, figure out what makes sense for you. The logistics of doing a podcast can be tricky, that’s why it’s kind of nice to figure out a way to get into one of the podcasting networks and come up with a show that fits a certain niche that really appeals to you and then understand how much work is involved in doing a regular podcast – which is quite a bit of work.

Tom Mighell: I think that’s where I could offer a bunch of different tips but I’m going to focus on really one and come back to what you said at the beginning which is: make sure that you have good enough quality equipment. I won’t say to go out and buy the finest microphone known to man, but make sure. Because there’s lots of good microphones you could buy for not a lot of money that will record your voice in a professional way. I think you’re right, the days of hearing people on the phone or on really bad microphones, our expectations are just so high. In fact, I listened to a podcast and I hear someone calling in on the phone and it’s offensive to me for some reason. I want to say, “Why didn’t that person have a microphone? Why couldn’t they all get together online somewhere and talk?” Like you and I are on Skype right now recording this and it just is kind of offensive to me. So invest in the right equipment, but the consequence in investing in that kind of equipment is if you’re committed to producing at least a reasonable to high quality podcast, you’re making a time investment too. Because you’re going to want to make sure that the editing is right, that everything sounds good. You’re either going to want somebody to help you with it or you’re going to want to take the time to be able to go in and do it yourself. It’s not impossible to do, it’s not rocket science to learn how to do it, it’s just time consuming. And I think that’s the one thing that people who want a podcast really need to consider when they do it, because unless you have a great team like the Legal Talk Network doing it for you, it can be a time consuming effort.

Dennis Kennedy: It used to be the equipment issue was a lot harder. I look at what I’m using here, Tom, and what I think is the same thing you use, is the basic Shure 58 Microphone, which is the standard professional microphone. USB adapter, audacity as a free program, and your podcast is going to sound great. I think why we’ve had a little difficulty of the interview format is you’re right, sound quality can be a problem if you’re listening to podcasts. So unlike you, Tom, if I hear an interview show and there’s a call in and you can tell it’s a Skype call, and either the sound quality of the call is bad where it’s hard to understand or it’s dropping out or something. I usually don’t finish listening to those podcasts. And the other thing that you run into on those is this big volume gap. So it could be that the host is really loud and then the guest is on Skype and you can’t hear him very well so you turn him up and then the guest really blows you out when you’re doing your thing. And there are simple ways to do that, but it’s nice to have a produced podcast. And I have friends who tell me you can find sound engineers where for them doing podcasts is like the easiest work in the world and they won’t charge you very much to clean up a podcast recording and make it sound very great. So there are a lot of tools out there and I think it’s way easier, Tom, than when we’ve started. So in that way, I think it is the ease of entry, given that you have to have good sound quality. That’s one aspect of where I think it’s a golden age of podcasting. The other thing is just the sheer volume and variety of podcasts right now, which I do think has never been better.

Tom Mighell: Let me come back for a second to say that I have recorded several interviews by Skype, and we’ve all connected on Skype and the recording tools for recording on Skype actually are pretty good these days. And I will say that with the recording quality, you’re at the mercy of your internet connection – and that can be an issue. But assuming you all have good connections and come through just fine, I’ve been real pleased with those results. I agree with you about the volume levels being different or one being loud and one being soft. But that again is something that a tool like Audacity can manage. You can level those out and make sure that all of those sound levels are the same. So again, I think you’re right, Dennis. We’ve gone from a world where the technology was expensive and hard to get to and to a world where it’s much cheaper and more accessible. But you still have some considerations that you have to think about. Let’s flip it around and maybe talk about listening to podcasts. Any update? We’ve talked about the podcast we recommend in the past, but any update now? Now that we’re in what everybody likes to think of as a golden age of podcasting, any advice for people who are interested in listening or who may already be listening and may want to up their game a little bit?

Dennis Kennedy: There are a number of podcast players, but I think a lot of people are going to either go out and find podcasts or run into them or they’re going to find them through iTunes – which is probably for most people going to be the easiest and best ways. And I mentioned this before because I’m such a believer in this these days is just using the search feature for podcasts in the iTunes store is really an amazing resource these days. I do a lot of things like if there’s a business book I’m not sure I want to buy or whatever, I can usually find a podcast where that author is interviewed and I can hear the main points of that book and decide where it’s something I want to buy or read. I can find information on specific topics to get me up to speed really quickly, especially on technologies, so that’s a great tool. Huffduffer is another search tool to find podcasts. And then I think it’s sort of like it is of blogging too. Once you find some podcasts, you’re usually going to find that they’ll mention other podcasts and you can sort of build these things out. But there’s a lot of things to explore and I think it will just amaze people how many podcasts are out there and the information you can get. And then also how many different podcasting formats and styles really work well. That’s what’s really astounding to me. The podcasts I like can be very different and it’s just amazing. If you show personality, you show good content, it’s like blogging. It’s the voice of the individual, and if that comes through, you can have a great podcast. If you overthink it, you might get an audience early on but it’s harder to hold it.

Tom Mighell: As far as recommendations for me, I agree with you. I think the iTunes podcast directory is probably the most complete location for podcasts anywhere on the internet. I’m sad that that’s the case because iTunes is not my favorite tool on my computer. So I – probably not surprisingly – don’t use it all that often to look for podcasts. I’ve been very pleased because interestingly, even though they have a great podcast directory, Apple’s podcast app is what I would consider to be average at best in terms of its features and its abilities. I recently had a friend ask for recommendations on podcast apps, and I’ve been doing some research lately and I think that my favorite app – and the one that I use for my Android phone – is called Pocket Casts. Pocket Casts is available also for iOS, although I understand that people who have iOS phones prefer, for the most part, using Overcast. Overcast is a very cool app, I downloaded it on my iPad, I really liked it. But one thing I don’t like as much on Overcast as on Pocket Casts is the discovery tool. Pocket Casts has got featured podcasts, trending podcasts, the top 100 in terms of popularity, it’s got podcast networks that you can look for. It’s quite a comprehensive app. It probably doesn’t have – in its directory – the same number that iTunes has, but it’s got a lot of stuff. So if you’re looking for a tool or an app that you can listen to podcasts on when you’re outside of the Apple universe and you want to have an independent app that works on both an Android or an iOS phone, Pocket Casts is a great purchase. It’s only $3.99, so it’s not a big deal. There are a lot of other apps out there, but that’s my best advice is to get a good podcasting app and then start listening to the podcasts the way that Dennis recommends. And I think you’re getting to experience some of the – I don’t really want to call it the golden age, but maybe a renaissance in podcasting.

Dennis Kennedy: I experimented with Overcast, I didn’t stick with it. I sort of lived in the iTunes world and the Apple podcasting app for so long, it’s hard for me to get out of old habits. But I do think that when you start, some of those recommended podcasts are an okay way to go because you can talk to people about podcasts. But we’re totally biased, and I’m totally biased on this, but if you’re a lawyer and you want to see what can be done with legal podcasts, the Legal Talk Network is clearly the easiest way to see a lot of high quality legal podcasts so you can dive in there a little bit, get a feel for that and sort of expand out, get some ideas and explore other legal podcasts as well. And ultimately, I think you can find your own niche.

Tom Mighell: I think that’s a good place to stop. Alright, before we move onto our next segment, let’s take a quick break for a message from our sponsor.

Advertiser: Looking for a process server you can trust? Serve-Now.com is a nationwide network of local, prescreened process servers. Serve-Now works with the most professional process servers in the industry. Connecting your firm with process servers who embrace technology, have experience with high-volume serves and understand the litigation process and rules of properly effectuating service. Find a prescreened process server today. visit www.Serve-Now.com. We’re glad you’re listening to Legal Talk Network. Check us out on Twitter, Facebook and LinkedIn too.

Dennis Kennedy: And now let’s get back to the Kennedy-Mighell Report. I’m Dennis Kennedy.

Tom Mighell: And I’m Tom Mighell. Alright, you know that we like to be on the cutting edge here at the Kennedy-Mighell Report, so we tend to go the extra mile to obtain the technologies you want to know more about. Or maybe we just want cool gadgets and get them for ourselves and play with them. For Dennis, Dennis has been first coveting and now walking around wearing his brand new Apple watch for a couple of weeks. So I was wondering if he was ready to talk about his experiences so far. Dennis, is two weeks too soon to give us a review?

Dennis Kennedy: As we lawyers like to say, yes and no. I’m always hesitant to rely too much on the earlier reviews, so I like to see when people come back after they’ve been using something for a while. And I think it is fair to say, Tom, that I did go the extra mile and sacrificed for our audience to get an Apple watch for myself, so I’m experimenting with that. So the experience so far has been positive, but I decided to take a really thoughtful approach to the watch because I think it is a new platform that it makes sense to go slow. I’ve also learned from my experience with smartphones and iPads and stuff that the notion of downloading a zillion apps and installing them is probably not the way to go on a watch. So I’m taking a go slow approach, I’m kind of sticking with the standard apps for now and then seeing what bubbles up as something that might work for me. So it’s really an experiment for me. So the experience has been great. I got almost the cheapest watch; a sports watch, black band. It’s interesting, I’ve had two people ask me if I’m wearing an Apple watch and that’s all; both of them were my brothers, which is kind of interesting. So I think it looks like a normal watch and there is an interesting way that you put it on because it tucks underneath in a way, but you get used to that really quickly. The band itself has a nice feel to it. I haven’t worn a watch in a long time and I like using it. There’s two things that I was looking for that people have talked about in using a watch, so one is notifications. I like that because I can see that I’m getting a text message or a phone call without taking the phone out of my pocket or off the table beside me. I like that aspect of it. I like the notifications on the health app – which I’ll go into a little bit more detail in a second – which alerts me to things like I’ve been sitting too long and I need to get up and stand, and some other things like that. There’s also a second thing called Glances which you swipe up on the watch face, and there’s about eight to ten things you can learn by doing that. So you can quickly see how much battery is left, the current temperature and weather, your pulse rate, a number of things like that. So that’s another interesting area of the watch. So what people are saying the functionality of the watch will be most interesting for people and what the apps will exploit are this notion of notifications in the Glances, or as they call them. So I’m thinking in terms of that. The health thing is the main thing that I use. So I can do something where I can set up a movement target and it figures out the calories that I’m burning during the day. I can also track exercise, it did a really nice job. I compared it to the Endomondo app on my iPhone when I was doing bike rides, and the milage came out very similar. The calories seemed to be calculated a little bit different, but that’s okay with me. So you can see calorie amounts, exercise amounts, and then it tries to get you to stand once an hour for at least twelve hours during the day. And it’s really interesting how that small amount of feedback really causes you to do some things. And that’s what I’ve used so far. What I’ve noticed is because of that, there’s a couple of apps that I’m now interested in that I think will take advantage of the watch. So one I believe is I want to try to drink more water, which I hate doing. So I think a water intake app that’s on my watch that fits with those health alerts would be a good thing. And the other thing that I think could be useful on a watch as opposed to on a phone is I’m a big tea drinker and the notion of a tea timer tied to the different types of tea that I use I think could be useful. So those would probably be the first two apps that I explore. But, Tom, my approach is go slow, see what reveals itself. Completely new approach to technology for me, by the way.

Tom Mighell: I think we’ve talked about on the podcast before that I’ve been wearing an Android Wear watch for some time now, and I will say that I’ve had a lot of people ask me if I’m wearing an Apple watch; a lot more than two. I’ve been having them ask me for several months even before the Apple watch came out, I’ve had people asking me if I was wearing it. I guess my experience has been the same. I’ve been reading with great interest the reviews and what people are saying about the watch. It’s interesting to me to find a very thoughtful range of opinions about it where some people are saying, “I just kind of like using it as a watch and actually looking at it,” and some people who are using it for a lot of the things that you talk about. But I still go back to what I said about Android Wear is that I think that one of the primary benefits of having a watch like this is to reduce reliance on the phone of having to use the phone. Because right now we spend so much time on the phone that it can be a distraction. But being able to swipe away a text message or a phone or something like that without having to pick up the phone and spend the time I think is tremendously convenient. I don’t know, Dennis, if you’ve had this issue in the past two weeks or so, but I will say that if I look at a notification on my phone, it gets less attention where I’ve at least on two occasions got a notification on my watch and I went to go look at it and I was in a room where someone was talking. And in both occasions, they looked at me and said, “Oops, guess we’re boring someone because he keeps looking at his watch.” And I wasn’t looking at the time, I was looking at the notification. So I think we may have entered into a different world of issues by looking at the watch instead of the phone. So I’ve noticed that that was an interesting complication of using these types of wearables. But I’m glad the Apple watch is out there, I think it’s going to make Android watches step up their game and offer new things. And I think that Apple watch – from what I’ve seen – it’s got a little bit of a ways to go. It’s very much a brand new product and it’s got some maturing and sophistication. But I fully expect Apple to rise to that challenge.

Dennis Kennedy: I think that the interesting thing about the Apple watch is how well it does work as a watch. The other thing that I’ve noticed is how hard with watches and wearables it is to demo the features for somebody. If you’re trying to show somebody what’s going on with the Apple watch, you have to hold your arm in a funny way and it’s really difficult to get people to do it. And then the parlor trick that people really like is when you can call them through your watch and talk to them on your phone. So people really love that, but typically you’re doing it while they’re standing about three feet from you, so it’s kind of a weird demo to do. Now it’s time for our parting shots, that one tip, website or observation that you can use the second this podcast ends. Tom, take it away.

Tom Mighell: So I’m going to come back to our first topic of podcasting to talk about a company called Narro. What Narro does is it assumes that you don’t have time to read all the articles that you find on the internet that are interesting and that you spend a lot of your time maybe in the car or commuting or exercising or walking the dog. So what it does is a Narro account will send those articles to a speech recognition engine and create a podcast feed of those articles. And you can select the voice and I would say the quality is pretty good. It’s not perfect, there are some issues with what I’ve heard. But I will say that I am one of those people who I tend to save a lot more articles than I have time to read. And I’ve been really enjoying listening to that content as a podcast. I will say that I’m not a fan of their business model right now. Right now the free account gives you twenty articles per month. If you want to read more than twenty articles per month, you’ve got to pay $8 per month, which seems a little high to me to have that. But I think it’s a great way to consume information in a different way. It’s called Narro.co.

Dennis Kennedy: I think that whole area is really interesting right now, Tom, so I’m intrigued by Narro but other things as well are out there. Brett McKay was a law student and he started a blog called the Art of Manliness, which focused on things like best razors to use and other things. And it grew into a business that he and his wife has done. I don’t know if he’s ever practiced law, but it’s obviously targeted to men but there’s great information for everybody. One of the things that’s been on my list to do for what seems like a couple of years – and I have the best of intentions – is to clean out and organize my garage. On the Art of Manliness blog recently – and we’ll put to side – was on June 30th, there was a post called How to Organize Your Garage. Like everything else that Brett’s done on Art of Manliness, a lot of great, practical tips on what kind of shelve to use, where to store things, and what’s the best way to handle things to give yourself more space to put the garage together. Actually, it’s a great motivation tool and something I’m vowing to do somewhere along the line if St. Louis weather cooperates sometime this year.

Tom Mighell: So that wraps it up for this edition of the Kennedy-Mighell Report. Thanks for joining us on the podcast; information on how to get in touch with us, as well as links to all the topics we discussed today, is available on our show notes blog at TKMReport.com. If you like what you hear, please subscribe to our podcast in iTunes or on the Legal Talk Network site where you can find archives to all of our previous podcasts. If you’d like to get in touch with us, please email us at [email protected] or send us a tweet. I’m @TomMighell and Dennis is @DennisKennedy. So until the next podcast, I am Tom Mighell.

Dennis Kennedy: And I’m Dennis Kennedy and you’ve been listening to the Kennedy-Mighell Report, a podcast on legal technology with an internet focus. Help us out by telling a couple of your friends and colleagues about this podcast.
Advertiser: Thanks for listening to the Kennedy-Mighell Report. Check out Dennis and Tom’s book, The Lawyer’s Guide to Collaboration Tools and Technologies: Smart Ways to Work Together. From ABA Books or Amazon. And join us every other week for another edition of the Kennedy-Mighell Report, only on the Legal Talk Network.